蝶恋花 红先胜 赵殿忠

zhaodi

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[DhtmlXQ_title]蝶恋花 红先胜 赵殿忠[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_author]将族[/DhtmlXQ_author]
[DhtmlXQ_type]实战全局/开局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]将族[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist][/DhtmlXQ_movelist][DhtmlXQ_comment0]苏轼 蝶恋花||花褪残红青杏小，||燕子飞时，||绿水人家绕。||枝上柳绵吹又少，||天涯何处无芳草。||墙里秋千墙外道，||墙外行人，||墙里佳人笑。||笑渐不闻声渐悄，||多情却被无情恼。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D33758%26extra%3Dpage%253D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
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邢春波

不知这局解的是否正确 [DhtmlXQ] [DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver] [DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init] [DhtmlXQ_binit]9999253958999999993299239999999999999930429999999946489999999999[/DhtmlXQ_binit] [DhtmlXQ_title]蝶恋花 红先胜 赵殿忠[/DhtmlXQ_title] [DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result] [DhtmlXQ_author]将族[/DhtmlXQ_author] [DhtmlXQ_type]实战全局/开局[/DhtmlXQ_type] [DhtmlXQ_owner]将族[/DhtmlXQ_owner] [DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum] [DhtmlXQ_movelist]32384849585946162547164623334241383041403020464220264246262240413343464522254544252441404342444324234344234340304232304032314445434445464445[/DhtmlXQ_movelist][DhtmlXQ_comment35]||||||红必得子[/DhtmlXQ_comment35] [/DhtmlXQ]

一杯红酒

不知这局解的是否正确[/quote] 第13回合，后炮进1，是黑的直接败因，改成后炮进2呢？ 这局结论不能明确！

zhaodi

邢春波 发表于 2015-1-24 20:02
不知这局解的是否正确

邢兄拟着有几处失误，先将前面失误着法指出。

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[DhtmlXQ_title]蝶恋花 红先胜 赵殿忠[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_author]将族[/DhtmlXQ_author]
[DhtmlXQ_type]实战全局/开局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]将族[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
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[DhtmlXQ_movelist]3238484958594616254716462333424138304140[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment10]？应将5平4和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment10]
[DhtmlXQ_comment9]？应相五进七。[/DhtmlXQ_comment9]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_8_1]46453830454430204445202445442434424133434131343844454333314138344544[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_8_1]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_8]和棋[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_8]
[DhtmlXQ_comment8]？应后炮退1或退2，可和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment8]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_20]不能进2，否则，阻碍前炮脱身。后炮进2，相五进七，再炮六平五，同主变胜法。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_20]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_24]红攻不下。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_24]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2]此步也是不明显的速败之着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3]改走炮六平五要速胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D33758%26page%3D1%26extra%3D%23pid245991[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

此局结论明确，红先胜。

近来论坛很活跃，一些新人都有一些棋局发帖，这是大家喜闻乐见的，但多是半成品或者转帖，有的棋局个人都没有探索出答案，就匆匆发帖，最后不了了之。我认为，排局创作要有“十年磨一剑”的态度，自己将着法探索清楚，再发出共赏。如果是确实个人研究不透，希望大家集思广益，要将自己研究的着法连同局面一起贴出，并讲清自己困惑在哪里，让大家共同参阅。不能一句“到此局面复杂”作为结局。另外一个习惯就是动不动就改局，原来的局面着法还没有研究透彻，贸然改局将棋局简单化或者复杂化都不是好的创作态度。

1963

邢兄拟着有几处失误，先将前面失误着法指出。 [/quote] 弄来弄去还是没弄明白赵老师的“黑方第1回合炮5进1要速败及第2回合红方炮六平五要速胜”的奥妙。我走来走去都回到邢兄走出的局面。

zhaodi

回复邓兄

[DhtmlXQ]
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[DhtmlXQ_title]蝶恋花 红先胜 赵殿忠[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_author]将族[/DhtmlXQ_author]
[DhtmlXQ_type]实战全局/开局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]将族[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment2]此步也是不明显的速败之着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2]
[DhtmlXQ_comment13]这两步退炮很有技巧。[/DhtmlXQ_comment13]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_1]090625070646483831415949[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_1]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_19]得炮[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_19]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_12_2]314147484131483831412547414038483041472940305949[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_12_2]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_23]得炮[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_23]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_11_3]464819164838314125471646472546163848[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_11_3]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_19]打转转，要想赢棋，还要还原到主变。即炮分两步退到花心，让黑炮离开2路。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_19]
[DhtmlXQ_comment23]得炮[/DhtmlXQ_comment23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_13]红不敢直接用帅吃炮，否则黑进炮闷宫。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_13]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_4_4]46162333424158594140484616194647404147484131483831412547414038483041472940305949[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_4_4]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_23]得炮[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment9]！这一个位置是要穴，此步也是关键之着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment9]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D33758%26extra%3Dpage%253D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
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1963

回复邓兄[/quote] 学习了！

zhaodi

1963 发表于 2015-1-24 22:40
学习了！

但黑还有更顽强的抵抗着法。

迟暮寒士

一开始只是想到黑方第1步有两种着法，不知哪个强哪个弱，既然黑方第1步走前炮进1是速败着法，那就只有走后炮平1、平2或平3了。 黑方一个速败变着，红方都这么难胜。那么，黑方顽强的主着，红方岂不是更加难取胜。

zhaodi

此局红方炮兵，黑方双炮，红无妙招难胜啊！

邢春波

[DhtmlXQ] [DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver] [DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init] [DhtmlXQ_binit]9999253958999999993299239999999999999930429999999946489999999999[/DhtmlXQ_binit] [DhtmlXQ_title]蝶恋花 红先胜 赵殿忠[/DhtmlXQ_title] [DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result] [DhtmlXQ_author]将族[/DhtmlXQ_author] [DhtmlXQ_type]实战全局/开局[/DhtmlXQ_type] [DhtmlXQ_owner]将族[/DhtmlXQ_owner] [DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum] [DhtmlXQ_movelist]3238461625471618233342413948414058571848575848493848304147294150585949393343504148384030594930404939[/DhtmlXQ_movelist] [DhtmlXQ_comment5_2]此步也是不明显的速败之着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_2] [DhtmlXQ_comment5_13]这两步退炮很有技巧。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_13] [DhtmlXQ_move_5_14_1]090625070646483831415949[/DhtmlXQ_move_5_14_1] [DhtmlXQ_comment1_19]得炮[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_19] [DhtmlXQ_move_5_12_2]314147484131483831412547414038483041472940305949[/DhtmlXQ_move_5_12_2] [DhtmlXQ_comment2_23]得炮[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_23] [DhtmlXQ_move_5_11_3]464819164838314125471646472546163848[/DhtmlXQ_move_5_11_3] [DhtmlXQ_comment3_19]打转转，要想赢棋，还要还原到主变。即炮分两步退到花心，让黑炮离开2路。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_19] [DhtmlXQ_comment5_23]得炮[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_23] [DhtmlXQ_comment3_13]红不敢直接用帅吃炮，否则黑进炮闷宫。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_13] [DhtmlXQ_move_5_4_4]46162333424158594140484616194647404147484131483831412547414038483041472940305949[/DhtmlXQ_move_5_4_4] [DhtmlXQ_comment4_23]得炮[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_23] [DhtmlXQ_comment5_9]！这一个位置是要穴，此步也是关键之着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_9] [DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_5]4849384842325859461623333231484616194647190947480919483831412547414038483041472940305949[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_5] [/DhtmlXQ]

zhaodi

邢春波 发表于 2015-1-26 19:46

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[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999253958999999993299239999999999999930429999999946489999999999[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_title]蝶恋花 红先胜 赵殿忠[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_author]将族[/DhtmlXQ_author]
[DhtmlXQ_type]实战全局/开局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]将族[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment5_2]此步也是不明显的速败之着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_2]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_13]这两步退炮很有技巧。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_13]
[DhtmlXQ_move_5_14_1]090625070646483831415949[/DhtmlXQ_move_5_14_1]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_19]得炮[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_19]
[DhtmlXQ_move_5_12_2]314147484131483831412547414038483041472940305949[/DhtmlXQ_move_5_12_2]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_23]得炮[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_23]
[DhtmlXQ_move_5_11_3]464819164838314125471646472546163848[/DhtmlXQ_move_5_11_3]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_19]打转转，要想赢棋，还要还原到主变。即炮分两步退到花心，让黑炮离开2路。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_19]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_23]得炮[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_13]红不敢直接用帅吃炮，否则黑进炮闷宫。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_13]
[DhtmlXQ_move_5_4_4]46162333424158594140484616194647404147484131483831412547414038483041472940305949[/DhtmlXQ_move_5_4_4]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_23]得炮[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_9]！这一个位置是要穴，此步也是关键之着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_9]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_6]461625471618233342413948414058571848575848493848304147294150585949393343504148384030594930404939[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_6][DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_5]4849384842325859461623333231484616194647190947480919483831412547414038483041472940305949[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_5]
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[/DhtmlXQ]

邢春波

[/quote] 这路胜法在6楼赵兄已经给了出来，所以没列。

zhaodi

答案，请指正。

[DhtmlXQ]
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[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999253958999999993299239999999999999930429999999946489999999999[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_title]蝶恋花  红先胜  赵殿忠[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_author]将族[/DhtmlXQ_author]
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[DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_5]4849384842322333323158594616484616194647190947480919483831412547414038483041472940305949[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_5]
[DhtmlXQ_comment17]！！红不敢直接用帅吃炮，否则黑进炮闷宫。||||炮五进二这一个位置是要穴，此步也是关键之着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment17]
[DhtmlXQ_comment21]这两步退炮很巧妙，需仔细品味。[/DhtmlXQ_comment21]
[DhtmlXQ_comment29]至此，妙得花心炮。[/DhtmlXQ_comment29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment63]红胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment63]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_19]迟胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_19]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_27]还原主着法，迟胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_27]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_13]速胜，下面攻法同主变第9回合。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_13]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_39]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_39]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_25]红胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_2]速败[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_2]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_23]同主着法第16回合，早胜4回合。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_23]
[DhtmlXQ_type]摆谱中残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]将族[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_comment0]苏轼 蝶恋花||花褪残红青杏小，||燕子飞时，||绿水人家绕。||枝上柳绵吹又少，||天涯何处无芳草。||墙里秋千墙外道，||墙外行人，||墙里佳人笑。||笑渐不闻声渐悄，||多情却被无情恼。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D33758%26page%3D1%26extra%3D%23pid245928[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

yjr123

zhaodi 发表于 2015-1-29 17:29
答案，请指正。

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[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999253958999999993299239999999999999930429999999946489999999999[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_title]蝶恋花  红先胜  赵殿忠[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_author]将族[/DhtmlXQ_author]
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[DhtmlXQ_move_5_4_4]2628394842415857284823334140575848493848304147294030585949394838304033434152594952414939[/DhtmlXQ_move_5_4_4]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment5_17]！！红不敢直接用帅吃炮，否则黑进炮闷宫。||||炮五进二这一个位置是要穴，此步也是关键之着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_17]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_21]这两步退炮很巧妙，需仔细品味。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_21]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_29]至此，妙得花心炮。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_63]红胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_63]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_19]迟胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_19]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_27]还原主着法，迟胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_27]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_13]速胜，下面攻法同主变第9回合。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_13]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_39]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_39]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_25]红胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2]速败[/DhtmlXQ_comment2]
[DhtmlXQ_comment6_23]同主着法第16回合，早胜4回合。[/DhtmlXQ_comment6_23]
[DhtmlXQ_type]摆谱中残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]将族[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_comment12]同主变[/DhtmlXQ_comment12]
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zhaodi

yjr123 发表于 2015-1-29 19:09

第5回合，红走软。应相七退九。
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[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999253958999999993299239999999999999930429999999946489999999999[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_title]蝶恋花  红先胜  赵殿忠[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_author]将族[/DhtmlXQ_author]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]3238484938484626233342415859413125072646483831415949[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_move_5_19_1]464819162547164647254616484616194647[/DhtmlXQ_move_5_19_1]
[DhtmlXQ_move_5_6_2]26464725423223333231585946164846[/DhtmlXQ_move_5_6_2]
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[DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_5]46262547484938484232233332314838314158592646472546163848414048461619464740414748413148383141254741403848304147294030594919104838304049591019334341505958191858571819385850412907403043423031394819155859151757581719593919144837413258481444423231413949[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_5]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_17]！！红不敢直接用帅吃炮，否则黑进炮闷宫。||||炮五进二这一个位置是要穴，此步也是关键之着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_17]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_21]这两步退炮很巧妙，需仔细品味。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_21]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_29]至此，妙得花心炮。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_63]红胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_63]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_19]迟胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_19]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_27]还原主着法，迟胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_27]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_13]速胜，下面攻法同主变第9回合。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_13]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_39]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_39]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_25]红胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2]速败[/DhtmlXQ_comment2]
[DhtmlXQ_comment6_23]同主着法第16回合，早胜4回合。[/DhtmlXQ_comment6_23]
[DhtmlXQ_type]摆谱中残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]将族[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_comment7_12]同主变[/DhtmlXQ_comment7_12]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_4_6]42322333323158594616484616194647190947480919483831412547414038483041472940305949[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_4_6]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_9_7]4838314125472646[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_9_7][DhtmlXQ_comment13]红速胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment13]
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