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[江湖局研究] 學士瀛洲

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1#
发表于 2023-10-19 01:17:56 | 只看该作者 回帖奖励 |倒序浏览 |阅读模式
白老師詮注本走法
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[DhtmlXQ_title] 竹香齋 學士瀛洲[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红先和[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]31415041727060827010473763333738333848383938494738484787665659674838674638488784484784444757445457477969[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment26]黑優[/DhtmlXQ_comment26]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_11_1]3949596766367969101969591959384849396759[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_11_1][DhtmlXQ_comment1_20]||黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_20]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_7_2]6668594763234838394947684959684759584766585979695949667823533747101869595359384849397859[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_7_2][DhtmlXQ_comment2_28]黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_28]
[DhtmlXQ_move_2_9_3]1018796963534858184858485357695957594768[/DhtmlXQ_move_2_9_3][DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]||黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]
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2#
 楼主| 发表于 2023-10-19 01:32:08 | 只看该作者
但不知最後是紅可和還是黑有勝法呢

有些別的詮注本 有修改局  但也沒有說原局黑勝
如果黑不能勝為何要修改呢

而且修改局又喪失假象陷阱  我不喜歡

白老師詮注本無修改局   結論也只說黑優

幾種詮注本看下來都沒給出明確的結論  

而我又棋力不精   所以一直搞不清楚此局究竟能不能和

呵呵呵   各位同好高手  能否指導以解我多年之疑惑
3#
 楼主| 发表于 2023-10-19 02:03:58 | 只看该作者
我有三種詮注本  綜合如下  都沒有說到底黑能不能勝 呵呵
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[DhtmlXQ_title] 竹香齋 學士瀛洲[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红先和[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]3141504172706082701047376333373833384838393849193848596748476746[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_26]黑優[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_26]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_11_1]3949596766367969101969591959384849396759[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_11_1]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_20]||黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_20]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment2_28]黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_28]
[DhtmlXQ_move_2_9_3]1018796963534858184858485357695957594768[/DhtmlXQ_move_2_9_3]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]||黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment16]黑方占優[/DhtmlXQ_comment16][DhtmlXQ_comment12]陸曙光先生詮注本走法[/DhtmlXQ_comment12][DhtmlXQ_comment4_12]白宏寬 周平先生詮注本走法[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_12]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_12_5]49433837[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_12_5][DhtmlXQ_comment5_13]以後局勢黑方較優||紅方也還可支撐[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_13][DhtmlXQ_comment5_12]裘望禹 蔣權 朱鶴洲||詮注本注3走法[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_12]
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4#
 楼主| 发表于 2023-10-19 02:20:58 | 只看该作者
本帖最后由 聨吟客 于 2023-10-19 02:30 编辑

陸曙光詮注本的修改局  是否有問題
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[DhtmlXQ_title] 竹香齋 學士瀛洲 陸曙光詮注本修改局[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红先和[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]631348383949[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_27]和[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_27]
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5#
 楼主| 发表于 2023-10-19 07:23:55 | 只看该作者
這個改局喪失了假象陷阱
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[DhtmlXQ_title] 竹香齋 學士瀛洲 裘望禹 蔣權 朱鶴洲
詮注本修改局[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红先和[/DhtmlXQ_result]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment22]和[/DhtmlXQ_comment22]
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6#
 楼主| 发表于 2023-10-19 07:28:52 | 只看该作者
5樓怎麼沒顯示標題  呵呵  是裘望禹 蔣權 朱鶴洲  三人詮注本的改局
7#
发表于 2023-10-19 09:19:33 | 只看该作者
优就是好走一些,但还不足以致胜。
再说明白一点就是和棋。
8#
 楼主| 发表于 2023-10-19 09:30:34 | 只看该作者
黑優而紅也能守和的江湖局  應該就是不錯的局吧

既然如此  為何上述的其中兩種詮注譜要做修改呢

而且改得ㄧ局紅簡單勝  一局喪失了假象陷阱

這是我百思不得其解的地方   ????????????

但不知還有無其他人的詮注本是什麼狀況的?呵呵
9#
 楼主| 发表于 2023-12-5 15:38:42 | 只看该作者
雪泥鴻爪1中 周廣程先生所擬的黑勝法

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[DhtmlXQ_movelist]3141504172706082701047376333373833384838393849433837596766364132101542203747675536564341150555360535204247373617565379695363172937386959635342605323405023736042735341013555504055454260533301004547404133354142353342524727004027472917472732413323170527255969383705243738524225274030656482642747425223212436473736173727172527474132384830404757254657474634475732415747413048383426472752422122304122024050021250301202261402014132013114263839695939384241383941312737314137305949[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_26]黑優[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment20]||黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment20]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_28]黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]||黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment118]黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment118]
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10#
 楼主| 发表于 2023-12-5 15:47:33 | 只看该作者
我棋力低微  有看沒有懂 只好慢慢學習

不知各位高手認為 這個走法結論是否正確?

第一次有人列出完整黑勝法  難能可貴  
11#
发表于 2023-12-13 10:11:37 | 只看该作者
9楼在原谱中有说明:
如图是《竹香斋象戏谱》1804年版初集第65局“学士瀛洲”,在1817年版为初集第59局,原谱着法为和局,实际上是黑胜。此局经过短暂的序战(俗称“脱帽”)之后,形成红方双炮未过河兵对黑方马炮底卒单缺士的残局形势,黑方的取胜方法具有一定的实用价值
      着法:红先黑胜

周广程的着法也有可商榷之处。第9回合改退马捉兵,兵无法保,早形成双炮,红只能苟延残喘

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[DhtmlXQ_comment4_26]黑優[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_20]||黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_20]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_28]黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]||黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_118]黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_118]
[DhtmlXQ_comment18]此招改为退马捉兵亦可。[/DhtmlXQ_comment18][DhtmlXQ_comment22]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment22]
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12#
发表于 2023-12-13 19:17:18 | 只看该作者
黑方的取胜方法具有一定的实用价值,但方法却难以表述,书中也不见方法。
黑方确实具有兵种和多士象的优势,感觉上也应该黑方可胜,但作为排局,红方可变之处太多,谱不能尽其变,读者看了和没看一样,归根结底还是要拼功底。
13#
 楼主| 发表于 2023-12-13 19:46:01 | 只看该作者
yjr123 发表于 2023-12-13 19:17
黑方的取胜方法具有一定的实用价值,但方法却难以表述,书中也不见方法。
黑方确实具有兵种和多士象的优势 ...

真是 精闢

沒聽說有攤主擺此局?   應該很適合擺吧  呵呵呵
14#
 楼主| 发表于 2023-12-13 20:49:39 | 只看该作者
本帖最后由 聨吟客 于 2023-12-14 01:57 编辑

   誰改的?[DhtmlXQ]
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[DhtmlXQ_title]第22局 学士瀛洲[/DhtmlXQ_title]
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[DhtmlXQ_result]和棋[/DhtmlXQ_result]
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15#
 楼主| 发表于 2023-12-14 02:23:57 | 只看该作者
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[DhtmlXQ_move_0_9_3]2010594763234838394947684959684759497969[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_9_3][DhtmlXQ_comment8]云庫這樣走黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment8]
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16#
 楼主| 发表于 2023-12-14 02:37:41 | 只看该作者
既然周  趙  余  等高手都認為原局黑勝   而幾個改局都不令人滿意
雖然我還沒弄懂黑要怎麼勝  呵呵呵  也先改一個  供參考研究
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17#
 楼主| 发表于 2023-12-15 15:11:08 | 只看该作者
有無撞局呢  呵呵呵
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18#
 楼主| 发表于 2024-6-6 04:38:36 | 只看该作者
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[DhtmlXQ_movelist]314150417270608270104737633337383338483839384944383782647473[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment15]||雙方應都難勝||呵呵[/DhtmlXQ_comment15]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D57487[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
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19#
 楼主| 发表于 2024-6-6 05:03:04 | 只看该作者
17樓能和否  呵呵呵   
20#
发表于 2024-6-8 16:10:37 | 只看该作者
本帖最后由 老鸽子 于 2024-6-8 16:15 编辑

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[DhtmlXQ_adddate]2011-11-05 11:51:01[/DhtmlXQ_adddate]
[DhtmlXQ_editdate]2011-11-05 11:51:00[/DhtmlXQ_editdate]
[DhtmlXQ_title]李浭 陶诒谟《江湖残局陷阱奇观》第27局 学富五车[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_length]0[/DhtmlXQ_length]
[DhtmlXQ_result]和棋[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_remark][/DhtmlXQ_remark]
[DhtmlXQ_hits]801[/DhtmlXQ_hits]
[DhtmlXQ_sortid]3958730[/DhtmlXQ_sortid]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]老鸽子[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_oldowner]老鸽子[/DhtmlXQ_oldowner]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]31415041727060826460415060635041702047376668483839493747634347484348384849484220[/DhtmlXQ_movelist][DhtmlXQ_comment20]和局[/DhtmlXQ_comment20]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_1_1]294720286434483834382829[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_1_1][DhtmlXQ_comment1_6]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_6]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_1_2]29074838393842647242494238396082[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_1_2][DhtmlXQ_comment2_8]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_8]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_7]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_7][DhtmlXQ_comment3_1][/DhtmlXQ_comment3_1]
[DhtmlXQ_comment0]第14楼实为此局,此局红车退一,需多费两个回合调整车位。其它着法略有不同。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
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21#
 楼主| 发表于 2024-6-8 20:28:28 | 只看该作者
鴿兄   看15樓
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