华工象棋论坛

标题: 百变象棋谱诠正六国和秦 [打印本页]

作者: chouzhouyu 时间: 2019-1-12 19:45
标题: 百变象棋谱诠正六国和秦
本帖最后由 chouzhouyu 于 2019-1-22 22:09 编辑

近两天才开始对百变象棋谱进行打谱诠正。很多诠正的地方也是参考网上的。许多地方还未仔细拆解完整。先暂发论坛，会陆续编辑一下。

该局该路变化参考了原位卒在江湖棋秘中的着法，但感觉其着法还是有问题。
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[DhtmlXQ_title]第37局鄱湖大战一路着法探讨[/DhtmlXQ_title]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment0][FEN=2ba5/9/4k4/9/9/9/9/4B4/5R3/2rAK4 b - - 0 15]百变原谱着法，和[/FEN]||||[FEN=2ba5/9/5k3/9/9/4R4/9/2r1B4/1r1cAp3/2B1KA1R1 b - - 6 10]对诠注本补充诠正一路着法[/FEN][/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3]||　　《百變》》、《淵深海濶》、《元機》等古譜的走法。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4]错失胜机。[/DhtmlXQ_comment4]
[DhtmlXQ_comment18][FEN=4k4/9/4b4/9/9/9/9/B3B4/1r7/3AK2p1 w - - 0 24]白宏宽18年版百变着法，黑胜。[/FEN][/DhtmlXQ_comment18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment19]诠正着法。||||该变最初被认为和棋（黑下步应以车3进2），后原位卒认为黑可胜（黑下步应以车2退1，红应以车二进四和车二进二）。||||||黑胜？？||||弈聪注：是否黑胜待拆。以下黑胜着法是参考原位卒在江湖棋秘中的着法。东萍棋库中可查到。||||暂未仔细拆解，感觉11回合红方应着有问题。[/DhtmlXQ_comment19]
[DhtmlXQ_comment62]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment62]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_43]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_43]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_21]？[FEN=2b2k3/4R4/5c3/9/9/9/9/2r6/9/2B1K4 w - - 1 20]原位卒黑胜着法[/FEN]||||其后续走法可能有问题，红士象全被吃掉了。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_21]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_27]黑车炮被牵。已和。||||黑要取胜，先要吃红士，且保留住自己的象。||||黑车一动，红帅马上平中有杀棋。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_27]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_72]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_72]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_31]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_31]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_25]败着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_27]红已负。||||主要是红士无法保住。红士一丢，即可认为黑胜。||||以下变化繁琐。[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_27]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_210]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_210]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_29]？||致使红仕最后被吃了。退士也可啊。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_35]？走其它好象也不好应。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_35]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_40]||　　至此，黑車炮象必勝紅車單相！以下紅如接走：[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_40]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_41]||　　如相七進九，則車３平１，車五進一，將６進１，車五平七，車１平５，帥五平六，將６平５，車七平六，炮６平２，至此，黑方可佈成『海底撈月』之式，紅負。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_41]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_68]||　　車、將佔中，黑勝定。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_68]
[DhtmlXQ_comment6_50]||　　至此，黑方可佈成『海底撈月』之式，紅負。[/DhtmlXQ_comment6_50]
[DhtmlXQ_comment7_78]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment7_78]
[DhtmlXQ_comment8_21]？[/DhtmlXQ_comment8_21]
[DhtmlXQ_comment8_22]||　　！[/DhtmlXQ_comment8_22]
[DhtmlXQ_comment8_26]||　　黑勝。[/DhtmlXQ_comment8_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment9_20]||　　？[/DhtmlXQ_comment9_20]
[DhtmlXQ_comment9_31]||　　和棋。[/DhtmlXQ_comment9_31]
[DhtmlXQ_comment10_31]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment10_31]
[DhtmlXQ_comment11_30]||　　黑勝！[/DhtmlXQ_comment11_30]
[DhtmlXQ_comment12_41]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment12_41]
[DhtmlXQ_comment13_19]黑胜。||||||　　這是原譜的走法，速敗之着。可改走車二退八守底線較為頑強，以下黑有兩種應法：||　　　甲、車３進２？仕五退六，車２進１，仕四進五（如車五平四？則將６平５，車四退三，車３平４，帥五進一，車４平５，帥五平六，車２平４，黑勝），卒６平５，帥五進一，車３平４，車二平六，車２平４，車五平六，炮４退２，相五退三，黑劣和；||　　　乙、車２退１！車二進四（如車二進二，則卒６進１！仕五退四，車３進２，帥五進一，車３平６，黑速勝！）卒６進１，仕五退四，車３平５，仕四進五，車５退２，車二平五，炮４退６，仕五進六，將６退１，車五平四，炮４平６，車四平六，士４進５，車六平二，車２平４，車二進四，將６退１，車二平五，車４平３，至此，黑車炮象必勝紅車單相！以下紅如接走：||　　　　Ａ、相七進九，則車３平１，車五進一，將６進１，車五平七，車１平５，帥五平六，將６平５，車七平六，炮６平２，至此，黑方可佈成『海底撈月』之式，紅負；||　　　　Ｂ、相七進五，炮６平５，相五進三，車３退２，相三退一，車３平９，相一退三，車９平７，相三進一，車７進２，車五平一，車７平５，帥五平六，將６平５，相一退三，車５退２，車一平六，炮５平１，車六退六，車５進４，帥六進一，車５平７，車六平五，炮１平５，車五進二，車７退３，車五平六，車７平５，車、將佔中，黑勝定（變着從略）。[/DhtmlXQ_comment13_19]
[DhtmlXQ_comment13_32]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment13_32]
[DhtmlXQ_comment14_32]||　　黑勝！[/DhtmlXQ_comment14_32]
[DhtmlXQ_comment15_21]||　　另有兩種走法，亦負：甲、仕五退六，車３平５，仕四進五，卒６平５，仕六進五，車５進１，帥五平四，車５進１，帥四進一，炮４退１，帥四進一，車５平６，黑勝；||　　　乙、車四平五，將５平４，車五平六，將４平５，車六進四，車３進２，仕五退六，卒６進１，帥五平四，車３平４，帥四進一，炮４退１，也是黑勝。[/DhtmlXQ_comment15_21]
[DhtmlXQ_comment15_22]||　　改正勝着之一！[/DhtmlXQ_comment15_22]
[DhtmlXQ_comment15_24]||　　！[/DhtmlXQ_comment15_24]
[DhtmlXQ_comment15_26]||　　！||　　||　　[/DhtmlXQ_comment15_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment15_32]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment15_32]
[DhtmlXQ_comment16_30]||　　！[/DhtmlXQ_comment16_30]
[DhtmlXQ_comment16_34]||　　！[/DhtmlXQ_comment16_34]
[DhtmlXQ_comment16_36]||　　黑勝。[/DhtmlXQ_comment16_36]
[DhtmlXQ_comment17_40]||　　黑勝！[/DhtmlXQ_comment17_40]
[DhtmlXQ_comment18_30]||　　！[/DhtmlXQ_comment18_30]
[DhtmlXQ_comment18_32]||　　黑勝。[/DhtmlXQ_comment18_32]
[DhtmlXQ_comment19_28]||　　黑速勝。[/DhtmlXQ_comment19_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment20_22]||　　改正勝着之二！[/DhtmlXQ_comment20_22]
[DhtmlXQ_comment20_40]||　　黑勝！[/DhtmlXQ_comment20_40]
[DhtmlXQ_comment21_32]||　　黑速勝！[/DhtmlXQ_comment21_32]
[DhtmlXQ_comment22_28]||　　黑勝！[/DhtmlXQ_comment22_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment23_22]||　　軟着，再失勝機。此時黑方另有兩種走法，均可取勝：||　　　甲、車３進２！仕五退六，卒６進１！車後退四（如帥五平四，則車３平４，帥四進一，炮４退１，黑速勝），將５平４！車後進七，象３進５，相五進七（如車後退一，則車３平４！帥五平六，車２進１絕殺，黑勝），車３平４！帥五進一，炮４退２，帥五進一，車２退１！帥五退一，炮４平５，黑勝；||　　　乙、卒６進１！車後退四（如帥五平四，則車３進２，仕五退六，車３平４，帥四進一，炮４退１，黑勝），車３進２，仕五退六，將５平４，車後進七，象３進５，相五進七（如車後退一，則車３平４，帥五平六，車２進１，亦黑勝），炮４平５，帥五平四，車３平４，帥四進一，炮５退５，帥四進一，車２退１，帥四退一，車４退１，帥四退一，車２進２，黑勝。[/DhtmlXQ_comment23_22]
[DhtmlXQ_comment23_34]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment23_34]
[DhtmlXQ_comment24_32]||　　黑勝。[/DhtmlXQ_comment24_32]
[DhtmlXQ_comment25_48]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment25_48]
[DhtmlXQ_comment26_20]红胜。东萍网中为黑胜，可能未仔细拆解，后发现是红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment26_20]
[DhtmlXQ_comment26_25]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment26_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment27_23]和[/DhtmlXQ_comment27_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment27_30]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment27_30]
[DhtmlXQ_comment28_23]劣着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment28_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment28_26]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment28_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment28_32]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment28_32]
[DhtmlXQ_comment29_26]又错过了取胜机会。[/DhtmlXQ_comment29_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment29_29]百变原谱着法，和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment29_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment30_21]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment30_21]
[DhtmlXQ_comment30_31]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment30_31]
[DhtmlXQ_type]实战中残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
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作者: dave7788 时间: 2019-1-13 08:58
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[DhtmlXQ_comment0]先找点小毛病。||楼主误认为这么走是黑胜定，漏算了红车七平三！[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D55099%26extra%3Dpage%253D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
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作者: chouzhouyu 时间: 2019-1-13 18:28
车3平5后直接作黑胜，是东萍棋库中的着法。可能是未仔细去拆解吧，凭感觉就定为黑胜了。我也未特别去留意。
当时打该谱时，发现有车二退八的和棋着法，在棋库中又特意搜索了一下，又发现原位卒有诠正为黑胜的着法。打了一下他的招法，感觉有问题。正常走下去，红方士相可以先保留住。黑取胜有点难度。

作者: chouzhouyu 时间: 2019-1-13 19:14
一楼又拆解编辑了一下。胜和关键是红士能否保住。其规律我还是没找到，只是根据软件拆解了一下。

作者: dave7788 时间: 2019-1-13 19:29
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[DhtmlXQ_type]残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]645240504729863652735040736140416142414253434252434507276947363839492729483968584555524255582939493918193938191838391858[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_32]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_32]
[DhtmlXQ_move_2_26_1]3858595818585158[/DhtmlXQ_move_2_26_1][DhtmlXQ_comment1_29]和局（原谱着法）。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_29][DhtmlXQ_comment30]和局。[/DhtmlXQ_comment30]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_4_3]8666[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_4_3][DhtmlXQ_comment3_4]现代排局家认为黑胜的走法！[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_4]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_18_4]685871791817[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_18_4][DhtmlXQ_comment4_20]李浭前辈诠注为黑胜，其实是和局。||我原来以为改走车3进2吃掉一相再车3退2能胜，后来发现红可接走仕四进五，黑不能胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_20][DhtmlXQ_comment0]“鄱湖大战”是元朝末年朱元璋和陈友谅进行的战略决战，被视为中世纪世界规模最大的水战，朱元璋取得完全胜利。《百变象棋谱》第37局“鄱湖大战”，红方双车一马集于一翼，好像摧毁敌船在即，其实红方杀力不足，黑方船坚炮利必胜无疑。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D55099%23lastpost[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

作者: chouzhouyu 时间: 2019-1-13 23:27
本帖最后由 chouzhouyu 于 2019-1-14 00:00 编辑

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_title]第05局兵行诡道[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_event][/DhtmlXQ_event]
[DhtmlXQ_date][/DhtmlXQ_date]
[DhtmlXQ_place][/DhtmlXQ_place]
[DhtmlXQ_round][/DhtmlXQ_round]
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[DhtmlXQ_blackrating][/DhtmlXQ_blackrating]
[DhtmlXQ_blacktime][/DhtmlXQ_time]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_remark][/DhtmlXQ_remark]
[DhtmlXQ_author][/DhtmlXQ_author]
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[DhtmlXQ_move_4_36_6]43426947826039386082383782642848[/DhtmlXQ_move_4_36_6]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_16_7]482747694243[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_16_7]
[DhtmlXQ_move_7_18_8]27467343826449394658393864824303[/DhtmlXQ_move_7_18_8]
[DhtmlXQ_move_8_19_9]493942437378462778284342694742433938434238374243284843483040[/DhtmlXQ_move_8_19_9]
[DhtmlXQ_move_9_20_10]463473333453304042403330[/DhtmlXQ_move_9_20_10]
[DhtmlXQ_move_7_17_11]734327353040424043403543[/DhtmlXQ_move_7_17_11]
[DhtmlXQ_comment0]||[FEN=2P2k1C1/4c4/8b/9/9/9/9/4B4/9/3K5 w - - 0 9]百变原谱着法，和。[/FEN][/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_comment22]诠正着法||||红炮只要离开这条线，黑马上可将军再退马至4路成和。红没有炮四进二的机会。[/DhtmlXQ_comment22]
[DhtmlXQ_comment34]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment34]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_22]？[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_22]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_31]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_31]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_29]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_22]？[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_22]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_25]这样马上可胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_39]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_39]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_53]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_53]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_51]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_51]
[DhtmlXQ_comment6_43]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment6_43]
[DhtmlXQ_comment7_18]可和？[/DhtmlXQ_comment7_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment8_18]？败着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment8_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment8_25]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment8_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment9_33]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment9_33]
[DhtmlXQ_comment10_25]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment10_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment11_19]红走其它，马4退2再退4和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment11_19]
[DhtmlXQ_comment11_22]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment11_22]
[DhtmlXQ_type]实战中残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_timerule][/DhtmlXQ_timerule]
[DhtmlXQ_endtype][/DhtmlXQ_endtype]
[DhtmlXQ_owner][/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_gametype][/DhtmlXQ_gametype]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.ccbridge.net[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

该局具体的红胜方法还未拆解的到。目前感觉11回合的退马位置有问题。

作者: dave7788 时间: 2019-1-14 08:41
第七回合红兵七平六请试试炮二退六

作者: 聨吟客 时间: 2019-1-14 09:33
這樣也勝

[DhtmlXQ]
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[DhtmlXQ_title]第05局  兵行诡道[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_result]
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[DhtmlXQ_move_7_17_11]734327353040424043403543[/DhtmlXQ_move_7_17_11]
[DhtmlXQ_comment0]||[FEN\u003D2P2k1C1/4c4/8b/9/9/9/9/4B4/9/3K5 w - - 0 9]百变原谱着法，和。[/FEN][/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_comment12_22]诠正着法||||红炮只要离开这条线，黑马上可将军再退马至4路成和。红没有炮四进二的机会。[/DhtmlXQ_comment12_22]
[DhtmlXQ_comment12_34]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment12_34]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_22]？[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_22]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_31]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_31]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_29]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_22]？[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_22]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_25]这样马上可胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_39]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_39]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_53]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_53]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_51]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_51]
[DhtmlXQ_comment6_43]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment6_43]
[DhtmlXQ_comment7_18]可和？[/DhtmlXQ_comment7_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment8_18]？败着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment8_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment8_25]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment8_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment9_33]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment9_33]
[DhtmlXQ_comment10_25]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment10_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment11_19]红走其它，马4退2再退4和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment11_19]
[DhtmlXQ_comment11_22]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment11_22]
[DhtmlXQ_type]实战中残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_17_12]735348674769674649594654538343535949534383875433304043404140505140503345[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_17_12]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_18_13]82644939482778286482393882643837648228482735484335433040[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_18_13]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_22_15]4627482882644939648269478264393864823837826428482735484335433040[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_22_15][DhtmlXQ_move_0_22_14]463448083446084846344808[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_22_14]
[DhtmlXQ_move_15_24_20]2746284846274828[/DhtmlXQ_move_15_24_20][DhtmlXQ_move_0_26_16]826469476482393882643837648208480614484314223040[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_26_16]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_24_18]25044939826469470412080164820111[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_24_18]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_24_17]2546084846254808[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_24_17][DhtmlXQ_comment17]||這樣[/DhtmlXQ_comment17]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_20_22]82647828[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_20_22][DhtmlXQ_comment22_21]參考主變[/DhtmlXQ_comment22_21]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D55099%26extra%3Dpage%253D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

作者: 豫东棋人 时间: 2019-1-14 09:46
[DhtmlXQ]
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[DhtmlXQ_binit]5364474839596999719999999999999907992030405242991845866899999999[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_23_2]7151585955594232595220425253293949391819[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_23_2]
[DhtmlXQ_title]鄱湖大战[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_type]残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]645240504729863652735040736140416142414253434252434507276947363839492729483968584555524255582939493918193938191838391858[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_32]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_32]
[DhtmlXQ_move_2_26_1]3858595818585158[/DhtmlXQ_move_2_26_1]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_29]和局（原谱着法）。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment30]和局。[/DhtmlXQ_comment30]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_4_3]86666947685871790737483718383938663637484535[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_4_3]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_4]现代排局家认为黑胜的走法！[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_4]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_18_4]685871791817[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_18_4]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_20]李浭前辈诠注为黑胜，其实是和局。||我原来以为改走车3进2吃掉一相再车3退2能胜，后来发现红可接走仕四进五，黑不能胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_20]
[DhtmlXQ_comment0]“鄱湖大战”是元朝末年朱元璋和陈友谅进行的战略决战，被视为中世纪世界规模最大的水战，朱元璋取得完全胜利。《百变象棋谱》第37局“鄱湖大战”，红方双车一马集于一翼，好像摧毁敌船在即，其实红方杀力不足，黑方船坚炮利必胜无疑。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_4_5]07275273504073614041532327236153[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_4_5]
[DhtmlXQ_move_3_5_6]69870727527350407361404153232723615341407170[/DhtmlXQ_move_3_5_6]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.dychess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.dychess.com/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D12499%26extra%3D%26page%3D39[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

作者: dave7788 时间: 2019-1-14 11:45
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
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[DhtmlXQ_title]兵行诡道[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_type]残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment0]成语“兵行诡道”意思是用兵可以运用诡异和作伪的战法，出自春秋时期军事家孙武《孙子•计》“兵者，诡道也。”||《百变象棋谱》第5局“兵行诡道”，原谱和局结论错误，应是红胜之局。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0][DhtmlXQ_comment2_29]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_29][DhtmlXQ_comment1_29]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_29][DhtmlXQ_comment31]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment31]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_11_3]49394838683859473848424829474841[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_11_3][DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]和局（原谱着法）。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D55099[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

作者: chouzhouyu 时间: 2019-1-14 11:50
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[DhtmlXQ_pver]130606[/DhtmlXQ_pver]
[DhtmlXQ_adddate]2013-07-23 15:54:01[/DhtmlXQ_adddate]
[DhtmlXQ_editdate]2013-07-23 15:54:00[/DhtmlXQ_editdate]
[DhtmlXQ_title]《象局彙存》初集之〝兵行诡道〞[/DhtmlXQ_title]
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[DhtmlXQ_move_6_20_7]48275828[/DhtmlXQ_move_6_20_7]
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[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_length]113[/DhtmlXQ_length]
[DhtmlXQ_hits]716[/DhtmlXQ_hits]
[DhtmlXQ_sortid]6357960[/DhtmlXQ_sortid]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]桑莫喜[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_oldowner]桑莫喜[/DhtmlXQ_oldowner]
[DhtmlXQ_comment0]||　本局是谢侠逊《象棋谱大全》内之《象局彙存》初集第三十五局。||　挚友傅信仁兄，在原谱的这一局夹有一页短笺，上面密密麻麻的写了这一局的取胜方法。开头这样写著：||　『原谱演成和局，其实红方可胜。且其胜法融合了〝盲公自绑〞与〝半边月〞的杀招，颇为微妙。』||　现将胜法披露如下：[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_comment11]||　胜着！||　原谱走帅五平六，是软手，只能弈和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment11]
[DhtmlXQ_comment15]||　退炮到这个位置，是本局能胜之重要关键！除此之外，黑均可守城。[/DhtmlXQ_comment15]
[DhtmlXQ_comment19]||　！[/DhtmlXQ_comment19]
[DhtmlXQ_comment21]||　！[/DhtmlXQ_comment21]
[DhtmlXQ_comment23]||　！[/DhtmlXQ_comment23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment27]||　又是一步关键的走着！看完全局自能体会。[/DhtmlXQ_comment27]
[DhtmlXQ_comment31]||　主帅跑到山顶，大妙之着！正所谓『高枕无忧』也。[/DhtmlXQ_comment31]
[DhtmlXQ_comment37]||　红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment37]
[DhtmlXQ_comment33]||　第14回合的飞相中路，这时起了大作用！[/DhtmlXQ_comment33]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_31]||　这种杀棋形成的图式，就像是月亮的一半。因此，此种杀法即称为〝半边月〞。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_31]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_25]||　紅速胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_31]||　紅速胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_31]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_29]||　〝半边月〞杀，红速胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_19]||　！[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_19]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_21]||　！[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_21]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_24]||　黑马自投罗网，实属无奈。这样自己跑去被牵绑的情形，象棋术语称为〝盲公自绑〞。既谑且虐，令人啼笑皆非。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_24]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_31]||　亦红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_31]
[DhtmlXQ_comment6_17]||　！[/DhtmlXQ_comment6_17]
[DhtmlXQ_comment7_21]||　以后红帅升顶，同主着法获胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment7_21]
[DhtmlXQ_comment6_23]||　飞相，腾出炮路。[/DhtmlXQ_comment6_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment6_29]||　红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment6_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment8_11]||　这是原谱的走法，是一步软着，以致成为和棋。[/DhtmlXQ_comment8_11]
[DhtmlXQ_comment8_18]||　黑棋倖和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment8_18]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.dpxq.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.dpxq.com/hldcg/search/[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

东萍棋库中找到一局，感觉应该是正解。各诠注本第8回合基本上是走炮二退三。他改进走炮二退八，打了一下谱，找不出毛病。

作者: 聨吟客 时间: 2019-1-14 12:50
直接炮二退八簡明
不須炮二退三

作者: 豫东棋人 时间: 2019-1-14 15:26
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[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
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[DhtmlXQ_pver]130606[/DhtmlXQ_pver]
[DhtmlXQ_adddate]2010-10-28 12:51:01[/DhtmlXQ_adddate]
[DhtmlXQ_editdate]2010-10-28 12:51:00[/DhtmlXQ_editdate]
[DhtmlXQ_title]兵行诡道（改图）[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_length]0[/DhtmlXQ_length]
[DhtmlXQ_type]排局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_gametype]慢棋[/DhtmlXQ_gametype]
[DhtmlXQ_result]和棋[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_hits]1460[/DhtmlXQ_hits]
[DhtmlXQ_sortid]2775380[/DhtmlXQ_sortid]
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[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.dychess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.dychess.com/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D12499%26extra%3D%26page%3D40[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

作者: 豫东棋人 时间: 2019-1-14 15:37
本帖最后由豫东棋人于 2019-1-14 15:39 编辑

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[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
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[DhtmlXQ_title]兵行诡道[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_author][/DhtmlXQ_author]
[DhtmlXQ_remark][/DhtmlXQ_remark]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红先和[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_type]古棋局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_group]散局[/DhtmlXQ_group]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment0]此妀局出自《象棋古谱残局诠正大全》第34页杨明忠老师指出如在八·十位底线加一红兵，使可按照原法弈成和局，经研究红无法和，红可以胜。请白老师指正[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.ok667.net/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.ok667.net/zqhuang/showlist.php%3Fpieces%3D11-23%26rpieces%3D5-15%26bpieces%3D4-10%26rpower%3D162-420%26bpower%3D210-470%26rp%3D3%26rc%3D1%26rn%3D0%26rr%3D1%26bp%3D2%26bc%3D1%26bn%3D1%26br%3D1%26bb%3D1%26ba%3D0%26rb%3D2%26ra%3D2%26fen%3D1P1k2P24P4b3c499994B4RCr1App23nKAB2%26mode%3Ds%26id%3D29274[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

作者: 豫东棋人 时间: 2019-1-14 15:44
如果黑1·3位加一个黑象是否可和请指正。
[DhtmlXQ]
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[DhtmlXQ_title]兵行诡道[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红先和[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_type]古棋局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_group]散局[/DhtmlXQ_group]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist][/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D55099%26page%3D1%26extra%3D[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

作者: dave7788 时间: 2019-1-14 17:08
14楼红胜正确！15楼也是红胜。“兵行诡道”原谱着法比较简洁，只要删去红七路兵即可按原谱着法成和。

作者: chouzhouyu 时间: 2019-1-14 18:31
本帖最后由 chouzhouyu 于 2019-1-15 18:50 编辑

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[DhtmlXQ_title]第65局驷马车（诠为红胜）[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_event][/DhtmlXQ_event]
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[DhtmlXQ_result]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_result]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment0]分类:双车炮类.||百变65局驷马车,竹谱二53局剑门设险,百局91局五丁凿路,渊谱184局神斧开山,神妙46局驷马车,秘录和37局.||||[FEN=3aka3/9/3n5/9/9/2R6/9/9/3K1p3/4p4 b - - 2 17]百局第1局[/FEN]||||[FEN=2b1ka1n1/4a4/4b4/3R5/9/9/9/9/3K1p3/4p4 b - - 2 11]百变原谱着法，和。[/FEN]||||[FEN=5a3/3ka4/3n5/9/9/3R5/9/9/3K5/4p1p2 w - - 11 21]竹谱第1局正和。[/FEN]||||[FEN=4ka3/5n3/1R1ab4/9/9/9/9/9/3K1p3/4p4 w - - 5 14]对各诠注本的一路诠正着法[/FEN][/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_comment26]至此可能已是红胜？||||先想办法灭黑象。不要让马跳到士角位保象。最后形成单车对马双士。（黑两个卒暂可忽略，主要还是起走闲棋作用）||当红车吃掉黑象后，形成单车对马双士（有底卒）的局面时，单车可以禁止住黑马双士和将的活动。此时黑只能动卒走闲，当黑两卒无法形成互保时还是会被消灭。除非有三卒或两卒在红角落与黑马两侧，这样才可成和。黑有三底卒时可以直接弃象，走马到士位即可。||||||红胜的招法没办法拟，红车吃象无固定招法且繁琐。只能以上说明一下。||||以下拟红的几种应对招法加以说明，顺便对各诠注本的着法注解一下。||||本局至此即判红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment27]走其它也可。不要让黑有士5进4或走马至士位的机会都可。[/DhtmlXQ_comment27]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_64]红胜。下略。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_64]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_33]劣着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_33]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_40]和[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_40]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_27]？各诠注本的着法，应胜反和。黑顺势上士再马退回士位形成例和定式。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_27]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_28]诠正着法。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_32]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_32]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_34]和[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_34]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_37]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_37]
[DhtmlXQ_comment6_45]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment6_45]
[DhtmlXQ_comment7_45]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment7_45]
[DhtmlXQ_comment8_54]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment8_54]
[DhtmlXQ_comment9_29]应改走車八平七捉象。[/DhtmlXQ_comment9_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment9_38]单车难破马双士加双连卒。[/DhtmlXQ_comment9_38]
[DhtmlXQ_comment10_33]百局第1局正和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment10_33]
[DhtmlXQ_comment10_42]竹谱第1局正和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment10_42]
[DhtmlXQ_comment11_78]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment11_78]
[DhtmlXQ_comment12_34]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment12_34]
[DhtmlXQ_comment13_56]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment13_56]
[DhtmlXQ_comment14_27]或平七，黑都可和。黑跳马后，红不能进底将军了，无法禁黑士。||||红车平九，还可胜，因黑无法跳马，红车有进底将吃士的棋。[/DhtmlXQ_comment14_27]
[DhtmlXQ_comment14_28]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment14_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment14_29]红平车，黑便回马准备跳到士位成和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment14_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment14_34]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment14_34]
[DhtmlXQ_comment15_29]红车赶马，黑马可跳象位再回士角。[/DhtmlXQ_comment15_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment15_34]黑有杀招。红只能退四守。[/DhtmlXQ_comment15_34]
[DhtmlXQ_comment15_36]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment15_36]
[DhtmlXQ_comment16_38]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment16_38]
[DhtmlXQ_comment17_27]红方动帅走闲也可胜。此时黑马士还是无法调整位置，也只能走闲着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment17_27]
[DhtmlXQ_comment18_27]车退二至六皆可胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment18_27]
[DhtmlXQ_comment18_29]这样黑马一时无法动。[/DhtmlXQ_comment18_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment19_25]弈聪注：该变也红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment19_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment19_52]红胜。下略。[/DhtmlXQ_comment19_52]
[DhtmlXQ_comment20_29]劣。[/DhtmlXQ_comment20_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment20_32]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment20_32]
[DhtmlXQ_comment21_26]朱鹤洲版本认为该变红可胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment21_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment21_93]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment21_93]
[DhtmlXQ_comment22_95]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment22_95]
[DhtmlXQ_comment23_133]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment23_133]
[DhtmlXQ_comment24_145]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment24_145]
[DhtmlXQ_comment25_99]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment25_99]
[DhtmlXQ_comment26_101]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment26_101]
[DhtmlXQ_comment27_85]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment27_85]
[DhtmlXQ_comment28_69]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment28_69]
[DhtmlXQ_comment29_73]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment29_73]
[DhtmlXQ_comment30_28]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment30_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment31_26]和[/DhtmlXQ_comment31_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment32_21]百变原谱着法，和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment32_21]
[DhtmlXQ_comment33_10]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment33_10]
[DhtmlXQ_comment33_16]弃兵吸引妙！黑可借此将红帅引至中路，以便用闪将战术调整象的位置，使双象连环，加强防御力量。[/DhtmlXQ_comment33_16]
[DhtmlXQ_comment33_25]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment33_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment34_29]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment34_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment35_26]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment35_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment36_9]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment36_9]
[DhtmlXQ_comment37_9]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment37_9]
[DhtmlXQ_comment38_9]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment38_9]
[DhtmlXQ_comment39_23]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment39_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment40_23]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment40_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment41_12]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment41_12]
[DhtmlXQ_comment42_4]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment42_4]
[DhtmlXQ_comment42_7]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment42_7]
[DhtmlXQ_comment43_3]？[/DhtmlXQ_comment43_3]
[DhtmlXQ_comment43_6]炮在马口，重炮做杀的计划被破坏，黑方获胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment43_6]
[DhtmlXQ_comment43_8]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment43_8]
[DhtmlXQ_type]摆谱全局/开局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_timerule][/DhtmlXQ_timerule]
[DhtmlXQ_endtype][/DhtmlXQ_endtype]
[DhtmlXQ_owner][/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
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[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.ccbridge.net[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

按各诠注本的着法，最后几步中红可变招最后形成单车对马双士的局面。

作者: chouzhouyu 时间: 2019-1-14 19:09
本帖最后由 chouzhouyu 于 2019-1-14 19:21 编辑

碨马车第13回合走车六退二也应该是红胜。原谱15回合车二退六捉卒，致使和棋。其实黑两个卒可以当不存在。
发现白宏宽版本中加了一个黑8。10位卒。对结果感觉无影响。

作者: dave7788 时间: 2019-1-15 10:34
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999958999999639999999999999999999930514199529999999999999999[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_title] 驷马车（红胜）[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]和局[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_type]摆谱全局/开局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]636041326030[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment0]\u0022驷马车\u0022可能弈成车对马双士(有底卒)的实用残局.||我们的残局功夫都不深,||所以我加了一个8路底卒以使局面明朗.||如果无卒,如图就是车胜马双士最简单的局面(即古谱所云赶马到无士一边的目的).[/DhtmlXQ_comment0][DhtmlXQ_comment3]红胜.[/DhtmlXQ_comment3]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D55099[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

作者: dave7788 时间: 2019-1-15 10:37
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999958999999639999999999999999999930514199529999999999995949[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_title] 驷马车（红胜）[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]和局[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_type]摆谱全局/开局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]6360[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment0]\u0022驷马车\u0022有两个底卒，如果走到如图形势，红车三进三胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D55099[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

作者: dave7788 时间: 2019-1-15 10:40
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999958999999639999999999999999999930514199529999999999795949[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_title] 驷马车[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]和局[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_type]摆谱全局/开局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]636079696070493970603949[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment0]我加卒后，如果走到如图形势时，红方无法取胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D55099[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

作者: dave7788 时间: 2019-1-15 10:55
本帖最后由 dave7788 于 2019-1-15 16:50 编辑

chouzhouyu 发表于 2019-1-14 19:09
碨马车第13回合走车六退二也应该是红胜。原谱15回合车二退六捉卒，致使和棋。其实黑两个卒可以当不存在。
...

用了三个棋图，说明一下加卒的作用。

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999958999999639999999999999999999930514199529999999999299919[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_title] 驷马车[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]和局[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_type]摆谱全局/开局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist][/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment0]车马对马双士，黑方有两个底卒时不可以当不存在。||如图，红方无法取胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D55099%26extra%3Dpage%253D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

作者: chouzhouyu 时间: 2019-1-15 18:49
驷马车红胜的招法无法拟。只能文字说明一下了。

对原谱再编辑一下。

作者: chouzhouyu 时间: 2019-1-16 00:20
[DhtmlXQ]
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[DhtmlXQ_title]第65局驷马车（诠为红胜）[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_event][/DhtmlXQ_event]
[DhtmlXQ_date][/DhtmlXQ_date]
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[DhtmlXQ_blackrating][/DhtmlXQ_blackrating]
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[DhtmlXQ_result]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_remark][/DhtmlXQ_remark]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment0]分类:双车炮类.||百变65局驷马车,竹谱二53局剑门设险,百局91局五丁凿路,渊谱184局神斧开山,神妙46局驷马车,秘录和37局.||||[FEN=3aka3/9/3n5/9/9/2R6/9/9/3K1p3/4p4 b - - 2 17]百局第1局[/FEN]||||[FEN=2b1ka1n1/4a4/4b4/3R5/9/9/9/9/3K1p3/4p4 b - - 2 11]百变原谱着法，和。[/FEN]||||[FEN=5a3/3ka4/3n5/9/9/3R5/9/9/3K5/4p1p2 w - - 11 21]竹谱第1局正和。[/FEN]||||[FEN=4ka3/5n3/1R1ab4/9/9/9/9/9/3K1p3/4p4 w - - 5 14]对各诠注本的一路诠正着法[/FEN][/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_comment26]至此可能已是红胜？||||先想办法灭黑象。不要让马跳到士角位保象。最后形成单车对马双士。（黑两个卒暂可忽略，主要还是起走闲棋作用）||当红车吃掉黑象后，形成单车对马双士（有底卒）的局面时，单车可以禁止住黑马双士和将的活动。此时黑只能动卒走闲，当黑两卒无法形成互保时还是会被消灭。除非有三卒或两卒与黑马两侧，这样才可成和。黑有三底卒时可以直接弃象，走马到士位即可。||||[FEN=1R3a3/3ka4/3n5/9/9/9/9/9/3K5/4p1p2 w - - 23 27]单车和马双士（两底卒局面）1。[/FEN]||||[FEN=3k1a3/4a4/3n5/3R5/9/9/9/9/4K4/4pp3 w - - 7 19]单车和马双士（两底卒局面）2。[/FEN]||||红胜的招法没办法拟，红车吃象无固定招法且繁琐。只能以上说明一下。||||以下拟红的几种应对招法加以说明，顺便对各诠注本现有着法认为可和的错误地方注明一下。||||本局至此即判红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment27]走其它也可。不要让黑有士5进4或走马至士位的机会都可。[/DhtmlXQ_comment27]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_64]红胜。下略。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_64]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_33]劣着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_33]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_40]和[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_40]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_27]？各诠注本的着法，应胜反和。黑顺势上士再马退回士位形成例和定式。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_27]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_28]诠正着法。仅此一招。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_32]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_32]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_34]和[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_34]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_47]红可胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_47]
[DhtmlXQ_comment6_47]败着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment6_47]
[DhtmlXQ_comment6_54]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment6_54]
[DhtmlXQ_comment7_37]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment7_37]
[DhtmlXQ_comment8_45]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment8_45]
[DhtmlXQ_comment9_45]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment9_45]
[DhtmlXQ_comment10_29]应改走車八平七捉象。||||弈聪注：也可。[/DhtmlXQ_comment10_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment10_33]红可胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment10_33]
[DhtmlXQ_comment10_69]可胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment10_69]
[DhtmlXQ_comment11_69]败着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment11_69]
[DhtmlXQ_comment11_78]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment11_78]
[DhtmlXQ_comment12_33]败着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment12_33]
[DhtmlXQ_comment12_38]单车难破马双士加双连卒。[/DhtmlXQ_comment12_38]
[DhtmlXQ_comment13_33]百局第1局正和。||||败着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment13_33]
[DhtmlXQ_comment13_42]竹谱第1局正和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment13_42]
[DhtmlXQ_comment14_34]和。||||弈聪注：红还可胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment14_34]
[DhtmlXQ_comment15_29]红可胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment15_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment15_37]红可胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment15_37]
[DhtmlXQ_comment16_37]败着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment16_37]
[DhtmlXQ_comment16_56]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment16_56]
[DhtmlXQ_comment17_27]或平七，黑都可和。黑跳马后，红不能进底将军了，无法禁黑士。||||红车平九，还可胜，因黑无法跳马，红车有进底将吃士的棋。[/DhtmlXQ_comment17_27]
[DhtmlXQ_comment17_28]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment17_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment17_29]红平车，黑便回马准备跳到士位成和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment17_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment17_34]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment17_34]
[DhtmlXQ_comment18_29]红车赶马，黑马可跳象位再回士角。[/DhtmlXQ_comment18_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment18_34]黑有杀招。红只能退四守。[/DhtmlXQ_comment18_34]
[DhtmlXQ_comment18_36]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment18_36]
[DhtmlXQ_comment19_38]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment19_38]
[DhtmlXQ_comment20_27]红方动帅走闲也可胜。此时黑马士还是无法调整位置，也只能走闲着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment20_27]
[DhtmlXQ_comment21_27]车退二至六皆可胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment21_27]
[DhtmlXQ_comment21_29]这样黑马一时无法动。[/DhtmlXQ_comment21_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment22_25]弈聪注：该变也红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment22_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment22_52]红胜。下略。[/DhtmlXQ_comment22_52]
[DhtmlXQ_comment23_29]劣。[/DhtmlXQ_comment23_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment23_32]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment23_32]
[DhtmlXQ_comment24_26]朱鹤洲版本认为该变红可胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment24_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment24_93]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment24_93]
[DhtmlXQ_comment25_95]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment25_95]
[DhtmlXQ_comment26_133]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment26_133]
[DhtmlXQ_comment27_145]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment27_145]
[DhtmlXQ_comment28_99]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment28_99]
[DhtmlXQ_comment29_101]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment29_101]
[DhtmlXQ_comment30_85]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment30_85]
[DhtmlXQ_comment31_69]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment31_69]
[DhtmlXQ_comment32_73]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment32_73]
[DhtmlXQ_comment33_28]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment33_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment34_26]和[/DhtmlXQ_comment34_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment35_21]百变原谱着法，和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment35_21]
[DhtmlXQ_comment36_10]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment36_10]
[DhtmlXQ_comment36_16]弃兵吸引妙！黑可借此将红帅引至中路，以便用闪将战术调整象的位置，使双象连环，加强防御力量。[/DhtmlXQ_comment36_16]
[DhtmlXQ_comment36_25]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment36_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment37_29]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment37_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment38_26]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment38_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment39_9]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment39_9]
[DhtmlXQ_comment40_9]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment40_9]
[DhtmlXQ_comment41_9]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment41_9]
[DhtmlXQ_comment42_23]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment42_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment43_23]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment43_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment44_12]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment44_12]
[DhtmlXQ_comment45_4]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment45_4]
[DhtmlXQ_comment45_7]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment45_7]
[DhtmlXQ_comment46_3]？[/DhtmlXQ_comment46_3]
[DhtmlXQ_comment46_6]炮在马口，重炮做杀的计划被破坏，黑方获胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment46_6]
[DhtmlXQ_comment46_8]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment46_8]
[DhtmlXQ_type]摆谱全局/开局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_timerule][/DhtmlXQ_timerule]
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[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.ccbridge.net[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

作者: yjr123 时间: 2019-1-16 08:15

chouzhouyu 发表于 2019-1-16 00:20

至第12回合已经红胜，着法见云库。

http://www.chessdb.cn/query/?4ka ... 9/9/9/3K1p3/4p4%20b

作者: chouzhouyu 时间: 2019-1-17 19:10
本帖最后由 chouzhouyu 于 2019-1-18 07:49 编辑

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[DhtmlXQ_title]第30局乌龙摆尾一路变化探讨[/DhtmlXQ_title]
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[DhtmlXQ_move_0_18_2]69792322797122215848454442604454717333430224545360424729426029076042[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_18_2]
[DhtmlXQ_comment0][FEN=4ka3/3P5/b3b4/2PP5/9/4P1B2/9/4B4/5p3/3K2c2 w - - 2 9]诠正着法[/FEN][/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_comment18]诠正着法。||||下步黑炮平6路，似可和。上步红直接吃掉士，黑炮也可走到这个位置防守。[/DhtmlXQ_comment18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment22]这局面应该和棋。一下看不出红怎么取胜。按正常走下去，一红兵应换士，另一红兵换黑象，最后为单炮对双兵。[/DhtmlXQ_comment22]
[DhtmlXQ_comment31]红兵也没什么步好走。[/DhtmlXQ_comment31]
[DhtmlXQ_comment41]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment41]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_36]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_36]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_21]红胜定？||||||弈聪注：有诠注本至此局面或上面回合中就判定为红胜定。感觉还是可和？[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_21]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_29]不进该兵，红中兵直接在黑左侧下去强行占肋呢。感觉可胜。黑炮卒又重新回到6路守还来得及不？[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_34]红没有有效的进攻手段。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_34]
[DhtmlXQ_type]实战中残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_timerule][/DhtmlXQ_timerule]
[DhtmlXQ_endtype][/DhtmlXQ_endtype]
[DhtmlXQ_owner][/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_gametype][/DhtmlXQ_gametype]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.ccbridge.net[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

因该局变化较多，暂时发现这个问题。其它几路变化还未仔细拆解。

作者: yjr123 时间: 2019-1-18 12:09

chouzhouyu 发表于 2019-1-17 19:10
因该局变化较多，暂时发现这个问题。其它几路变化还未仔细拆解。

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
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[DhtmlXQ_title]第30局乌龙摆尾一路变化探讨[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]和局[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]561619291626292826764858594928262524266676783848493966697858485824234150454469594443426433320224233350413222413022214050394950514725[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_27_1]3242644243424152393840504252595231415202[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_27_1]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_18_2]69792322797122215848454442604454717333430224545360424729426029076042[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_18_2]
[DhtmlXQ_comment0][FEN\u003D4ka3/3P5/b3b4/2PP5/9/4P1B2/9/4B4/5p3/3K2c2 w - - 2 9]诠正着法[/FEN][/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_comment18]诠正着法。||||下步黑炮平6路，似可和。上步红直接吃掉士，黑炮也可走到这个位置防守。[/DhtmlXQ_comment18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment22]这局面应该和棋。一下看不出红怎么取胜。按正常走下去，一红兵应换士，另一红兵换黑象，最后为单炮对双兵。[/DhtmlXQ_comment22]
[DhtmlXQ_comment31]红兵也没什么步好走。[/DhtmlXQ_comment31]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_41]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_41]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_36]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_36]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_21]红胜定？||||||弈聪注：有诠注本至此局面或上面回合中就判定为红胜定。感觉还是可和？[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_21]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_29]不进该兵，红中兵直接在黑左侧下去强行占肋呢。感觉可胜。黑炮卒又重新回到6路守还来得及不？[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_34]红没有有效的进攻手段。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_34]
[DhtmlXQ_type]实战中残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D55099[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

作者: chouzhouyu 时间: 2019-1-18 15:55
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[DhtmlXQ_move_0_33_1]313059793332797121316442658771613040[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_33_1]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_33_2]6587304187694150472551522120[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_33_2]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment0][FEN=4ka3/3P5/b3b4/2PP5/9/4P1B2/9/4B4/5p3/3K2c2 w - - 2 9]诠正着法[/FEN][/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_comment18]诠正着法。||||下步黑炮平6路，似可和。上步红直接吃掉士，黑炮也可走到这个位置防守。[/DhtmlXQ_comment18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment22]这局面应该和棋。一下看不出红怎么取胜。按正常走下去，一红兵应换士，另一红兵换黑象，最后为单炮对双兵。[/DhtmlXQ_comment22]
[DhtmlXQ_comment31]红兵也没什么步好走。[/DhtmlXQ_comment31]
[DhtmlXQ_comment35]不吃士黑士退到将后红好象更难取胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment35]
[DhtmlXQ_comment40]现在只能把炮退回了，否则红中兵一移开马上可定位了。||||黑炮一移开退回守即和。那么前面回合红相先落回不让黑炮有移开的机会。先调整好阵形再进攻呢。第17回合红相三退一。[/DhtmlXQ_comment40]
[DhtmlXQ_comment42]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment42]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_41]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_41]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_33]黑炮本来就打算在那个位置固守。不让红兵从两侧进攻。但红兵换掉一个士后，一低兵再进一步时炮可再退回守。红走该步，目的是先调整阵形，索性不让黑炮有平移退回的机会。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_33]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_39]还是可和吧。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_39]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_36]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_36]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_21]红胜定？||||||弈聪注：有诠注本至此局面或上面回合中就判定为红胜定。感觉还是可和？[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_21]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_29]不进该兵，红中兵直接在黑左侧下去强行占肋呢。感觉可胜。黑炮卒又重新回到6路守还来得及不？[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_34]红没有有效的进攻手段。[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_34]
[DhtmlXQ_type]实战中残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_timerule][/DhtmlXQ_timerule]
[DhtmlXQ_endtype][/DhtmlXQ_endtype]
[DhtmlXQ_owner][/DhtmlXQ_owner]
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[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.ccbridge.net[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

作者: chouzhouyu 时间: 2019-1-18 17:34
刚发现黑士5退6，红先兵六平五，这样红两兵还是可从两侧下去。

作者: dave7788 时间: 2019-1-22 09:59
本帖最后由 dave7788 于 2019-1-22 10:00 编辑

探讨《百变象棋谱》“三军争舟”
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[DhtmlXQ_title]三军争舟/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_type]残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment31]红炮换双卒胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment31][DhtmlXQ_comment0]《韬略元机》“昭君出塞”“匹马从戎”《渊深海阔》“弓雷马电”棋图完全相同，《棋谱秘录》也收入，都是和局。近日看到一本书谱诠为红胜，特提出来请大家探讨。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_9_1]335451415446584857583738583848383938[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_9_1][DhtmlXQ_comment1_17]和局（原谱着法）[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_17][DhtmlXQ_comment9]这是《竹香斋》的走法，因原谱增加了黑1.7位卒，黑谋和不难。[/DhtmlXQ_comment9][DhtmlXQ_comment11]这就是新看到的走法。《竹香斋》是走炮四进三，和局。[/DhtmlXQ_comment11][DhtmlXQ_comment12]这是书谱的走法。改走士6进5呢[/DhtmlXQ_comment12]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_12_2]5041[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_12_2]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D55099%26extra%3Dpage%253D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

作者: dave7788 时间: 2019-1-22 10:53
《百变象棋谱》第42局三军争舟
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999939999933309973999999995399999941515099579999999999594837[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_type]残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment31]红炮换双卒胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment31]
[DhtmlXQ_comment0]《韬略元机》“昭君出塞”“匹马从戎”《渊深海阔》“弓雷马电”棋图完全相同，《棋谱秘录》也收入，都是和局。近日看到一本书谱诠为红胜，特提出来请大家探讨。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_9_1]335451415446584857583738583848383938[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_9_1]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_17]和局（原谱着法）[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_17]
[DhtmlXQ_comment9]这是《竹香斋》的走法，因原谱增加了黑1.7位卒，黑谋和不难。[/DhtmlXQ_comment9]
[DhtmlXQ_comment11]这就是新看到的走法。《竹香斋》是走炮四进三，和局。[/DhtmlXQ_comment11]
[DhtmlXQ_comment12]这是书谱的走法。改走士6进5呢[/DhtmlXQ_comment12]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_12_2]5041455341525334514134554748565258595259484939384959[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_12_2]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_24]和局。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_24]
[DhtmlXQ_move_2_15_3]537251417264[/DhtmlXQ_move_2_15_3]
[DhtmlXQ_move_2_15_4]53325141[/DhtmlXQ_move_2_15_4]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D55099[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

作者: chouzhouyu 时间: 2019-1-22 12:14
本帖最后由 chouzhouyu 于 2019-1-22 12:23 编辑

我棋库中红炮四进一后，黑下步是士6进5。查了一下棋库。发现有象棋桥软件后，其作者提供的韬略元机象棋谱中的匹马从戎就是以该路为主变。东萍棋库中应该基本上是该路着法。

作者: chouzhouyu 时间: 2019-1-22 12:25
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
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[DhtmlXQ_title]第42局  三军争舟[/DhtmlXQ_title]
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[DhtmlXQ_move_0_6_16]415230315041314151504148[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_6_16]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment0]分类:单车马炮类.||元谱83局昭君出塞,元谱21局匹马从戎,百变42局三军争舟,渊谱147局弓雷马电,秘录和44局.竹谱一2局海树波平(1817年版)||||[FEN=3a1a3/4k4/9/9/9/9/4N4/9/3K5/9 b - - 0 9]百变原谱着法，和。[/FEN]||||||||[FEN=3a1a3/5k3/9/9/9/4N4/5C3/4p4/5p3/3K5 b - - 3 6]拆解局面。[/FEN][/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_comment9]弈至该形势，红方已立不败之地。[/DhtmlXQ_comment9]
[DhtmlXQ_comment17]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment17]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_16]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_16]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_16]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_16]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_9]这是《竹香斋》的走法，因原谱增加了黑1.7位卒，黑谋和不难。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_9]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_11]这就是新看到的走法。《竹香斋》是走炮四进三，和局。||||||[FEN=3a5/4k4/9/9/9/9/4N4/9/1C2pp3/3K5 b - - 16 16]某诠注本中的红胜着法，待拆。[/FEN][/DhtmlXQ_comment3_11]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_23]及时回马，明智之着。如硬要贪胜进攻，则徒劳无益，结果后防空虚，反要输棋。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_30]捉死马和定。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_30]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_28]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_32]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_32]
[DhtmlXQ_comment6_21]马后炮杀，红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment6_21]
[DhtmlXQ_comment7_26]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment7_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment8_27]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment8_27]
[DhtmlXQ_comment9_12]这是书谱的走法。改走士6进5呢[/DhtmlXQ_comment9_12]
[DhtmlXQ_comment9_31]红炮换双卒胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment9_31]
[DhtmlXQ_comment9_37]单马必胜单士。[/DhtmlXQ_comment9_37]
[DhtmlXQ_comment10_21]得卒胜定。[/DhtmlXQ_comment10_21]
[DhtmlXQ_comment12_16]    ③正着。如误走将6进1，则炮五平四，将6平5，炮四进六吃士后，很容易一炮换双卒，形成匹马擒单士必胜的残局。[/DhtmlXQ_comment12_16]
[DhtmlXQ_comment12_29]    和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment12_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment13_19]    吃士后，很容易一炮换双卒，形成匹马擒单士必胜的残局。[/DhtmlXQ_comment13_19]
[DhtmlXQ_comment14_13]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment14_13]
[DhtmlXQ_comment15_13]    和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment15_13]
[DhtmlXQ_comment16_11]    吃卒，红胜定。[/DhtmlXQ_comment16_11]
[DhtmlXQ_comment17_15]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment17_15]
[DhtmlXQ_comment18_9]    吃卒，红胜定。[/DhtmlXQ_comment18_9]
[DhtmlXQ_type]摆谱全局/开局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
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作者: chouzhouyu 时间: 2019-1-22 12:35
街头象棋150局中有该局，选择这路变化，不过其后续走法可能有问题，没有走成一炮换双卒的变化，走和了。

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_title]  第100局江岸一战[/DhtmlXQ_title]
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[DhtmlXQ_result]和局[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_remark]王光州杜翊王万民[/DhtmlXQ_remark]
[DhtmlXQ_author]兵法[/DhtmlXQ_author]
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[DhtmlXQ_move_0_7_2]3345585945574130577859693949[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_7_2]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_6_3]415230315041314151504148[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_6_3]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_6_4]5778335478593037[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_6_4]
[DhtmlXQ_comment0]    夏游九江时，江岸一群人围观此局，黑马卒宫内要杀，红方虽然不易轻解，但有车马炮兵的攻杀之势，经过激战，还是成和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_comment6]    ①正着。另有两种着法：||    其一，士5进6，车六退一，士6进5，车六平五，将6退1，车五退七吃卒，红胜定。||    其二，马6进8，马六退四，马8进6，车六退七吃卒，红胜定。[/DhtmlXQ_comment6]
[DhtmlXQ_comment7]    ②正着。亦可走马六退五，卒6进1，马五退四，士5退4，马四退二，卒6平7，帅六平五，和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment7]
[DhtmlXQ_comment16]    ③正着。如误走将6进1，则炮五平四，将6平5，炮四进六吃士后，很容易一炮换双卒，形成匹马擒单士必胜的残局。[/DhtmlXQ_comment16]
[DhtmlXQ_comment29]    和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_19]    吃士后，很容易一炮换双卒，形成匹马擒单士必胜的残局。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_19]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_13]    和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_13]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_11]    吃卒，红胜定。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_11]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_9]    吃卒，红胜定。[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_9]
[DhtmlXQ_type]摆谱中残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_timerule][/DhtmlXQ_timerule]
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[DhtmlXQ_owner]  [/DhtmlXQ_owner]
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[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.ccbridge.net[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

作者: dave7788 时间: 2019-1-22 16:20
本帖最后由 dave7788 于 2019-1-22 16:22 编辑

嗯，看的书比我多。
古谱中有许多重复的棋局，因此，有一局错了或者诠错了就涉及好几局。我最近看的诠注本就将“三军争舟”“弓雷马电”“昭君出塞”“匹马从戎”以及《棋谱秘录》中的相同局都作为红胜啦。

作者: chouzhouyu 时间: 2019-1-22 21:04
[DhtmlXQ]
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[DhtmlXQ_title]第57局六国和秦一路变化[/DhtmlXQ_title]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment0][FEN=3k5/2P1C4/4b3b/9/9/6B2/6p2/B8/5p3/4K4 b - - 0 12]百变原谱着法，和[/FEN][/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_comment12][FEN=3Ck4/2P2P3/4b3b/9/9/9/1c6p/B3p4/5p3/2B1K4 w - - 17 14]相同局面[/FEN][/DhtmlXQ_comment12]
[DhtmlXQ_comment19]早期诠注本认为该变可红胜。后白宏宽有一路和棋着法，感觉也有问题。||||[FEN=3k2PC1/2P6/4b4/9/9/4c1B2/3p5/B8/5p3/4K4 b - - 0 18]红胜1[/FEN]||||[FEN=4k1b2/3P1P3/9/9/2b6/6B2/3c2p2/B8/4C4/3K5 b - - 2 16]红胜2[/FEN][/DhtmlXQ_comment19]
[DhtmlXQ_comment27]这样黑炮没办法再平中了。只能长打兵。[/DhtmlXQ_comment27]
[DhtmlXQ_comment32]黑方应该是长打，须变招。[/DhtmlXQ_comment32]
[DhtmlXQ_comment37]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment37]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_40]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_40]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_35]紅勝。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_35]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_29]紅胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_29]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_31]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_31]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_35]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_35]
[DhtmlXQ_comment6_23]和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment6_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment7_23]不变作和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment7_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment7_28]还原到前面第6回合时的局面。形成死循环了。||||该局这样循环判和吗？或前面不变作和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment7_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment8_28][FEN=3Ck4/2P2P3/4b3b/9/9/9/1c6p/B3p4/5p3/2B1K4 w - - 17 14]相同局面，还原到主变中（前面第6回合走该着）[/FEN][/DhtmlXQ_comment8_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment9_23]还原。[/DhtmlXQ_comment9_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment10_34]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment10_34]
[DhtmlXQ_comment11_32]黑胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment11_32]
[DhtmlXQ_type]实战中残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
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作者: dave7788 时间: 2019-1-23 08:58
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[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999079939996599993199215199999999994299309960999926999958569999[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_title]六国和秦一路变化[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]和局[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_type]残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]514142240725244225074224072524422507[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1]杨明忠前辈认为这样走是红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1][DhtmlXQ_comment9]双方不变，全国比赛现行象棋规则怎么判我不清楚，觉得按旧规应该是和局（诠注古局不能按国内现行的严格规则判，还是按《湖涯集》“四寇擒王”的规则处理比较贴切）。[/DhtmlXQ_comment9]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D55099%26page%3D2[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

作者: dave7788 时间: 2019-1-23 10:23
看了一部新书，写的非常好！书中引用的古局不多，但用我们这些推敲排局并傻傻叫真的人来看是有问题的，比如《适情雅趣》中的“七擒七纵”，我们认为薛丙的意见正确，应该是黑胜（错局），新书中依然作为和局。如果说和局的结论不对，那么，按亚洲规则，确实可和。去年，世界规则诞生，甚得好评，说是以后的亚洲比赛、世界比赛均采用。我想，世界规则与亚洲规则可能很接近吧。

作者: 聨吟客 时间: 2019-1-23 10:38

dave7788 发表于 2019-1-23 10:23
看了一部新书，写的非常好！书中引用的古局不多，但用我们这些推敲排局并傻傻叫真的人来看是有问题的，比如 ...

亞洲規則也是不允許走動炮架長捉無根子的

世界規則?我就不清楚了

作者: chouzhouyu 时间: 2019-1-23 11:12
还是第6回合走炮2进3，最后不变作和列为主变较好。

作者: yjr123 时间: 2019-1-23 12:42

dave7788 发表于 2019-1-23 08:58

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
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[DhtmlXQ_title]六国和秦一路变化[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]和局[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_type]残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]3136[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_1]杨明忠前辈认为这样走是红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_1]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_9]双方不变，全国比赛现行象棋规则怎么判我不清楚，觉得按旧规应该是和局（诠注古局不能按国内现行的严格规则判，还是按《湖涯集》“四寇擒王”的规则处理比较贴切）。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_9]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1]这样红胜吗？[/DhtmlXQ_comment1]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D55099%26page%3D2[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
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作者: dave7788 时间: 2019-1-23 12:45
本帖最后由 dave7788 于 2019-1-23 13:11 编辑

亚洲规则陈先生熟悉.我没有看亚洲规则,只是在书谱上看到"一将一杀""一将一捉"等双方不变作和.关于37楼棋例,我的理解是黑捉和红杀的问题,不是单方长捉.
至于"六国和秦"结果是和局应无疑.85本认为炮2进3是劣着,我看是正着,在诠注本心武残编"双辖投泉"(与六国和秦相相似中已经作为主着法了.

作者: dave7788 时间: 2019-1-23 13:05
象棋规则十分复杂.全国比赛中出现棋例纠纷时,时常有当值裁判解决不了交由裁判组研究的,判定之后也出现棋手虽服从但仍保留意见的.
编写象棋书谱涉及到棋例时,作者的处理不尽相同.哪本书作者的意见也不可能符合所有读者的胃口.我的意见是诠注古谱以"两打一还打"不变作和为基础,特殊情况(比如蚯蚓降龙)加以说明.

作者: dave7788 时间: 2019-1-23 13:19
本帖最后由 dave7788 于 2019-1-23 14:01 编辑

yjr123 发表于 2019-1-23 12:42

高！说到了点子上。
[DhtmlXQ]
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[DhtmlXQ_title] 六国和秦[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]和局[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_type]残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment30]和局。[/DhtmlXQ_comment30]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_1]30405141404121314140313040418381[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_1][DhtmlXQ_comment1_9]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_9]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_7_2]3438161938394647[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_7_2]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_12_3]46473000403029471646476586760002826002327666323166564939462631364224072524022507022407252442250742240725[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_12_3][DhtmlXQ_comment3_37]黑方不变作负，红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_37]
[DhtmlXQ_move_3_26_4]565751504636317158487170[/DhtmlXQ_move_3_26_4][DhtmlXQ_comment4_31]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_31]
[DhtmlXQ_move_3_19_5]00017666514146410141[/DhtmlXQ_move_3_19_5][DhtmlXQ_comment5_23]和局（原谱着法）[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_23]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_6]464739195848495947571918426429474858594957472120[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_6][DhtmlXQ_comment6_25]红胜（1985年诠注本的走法）[/DhtmlXQ_comment6_25][DhtmlXQ_comment3_27]余俊瑞先生的走法！[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_27]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D55099%26extra%3Dpage%253D1%26page%3D2[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
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作者: 聨吟客 时间: 2019-1-23 20:25

dave7788 发表于 2019-1-23 12:45
亚洲规则陈先生熟悉.我没有看亚洲规则,只是在书谱上看到"一将一杀""一将一捉"等双方不变作和.关于37楼棋例, ...

嗯
長捉對長殺大陸規則和局

亞洲規則卻長捉方敗

作者: chouzhouyu 时间: 2021-3-1 21:12
同驷马车很相似的一则局。载于象棋排局例典。

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[DhtmlXQ_title] 第17局逐鹿江湖[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_event]象棋排局例典[/DhtmlXQ_event]
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[DhtmlXQ_result]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_result]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment16]已和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment16]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_17] 单车对马双底卒双士结局如何?尚无明确定论。其实，只有马在己方士角位，将与马同处一侧，双底||卒于另一侧连结才可和局;另外，单车被马双士三子围困于黑将位置，亦可和局。此外，单车方多有获胜机。此时棋势，红方就可取胜，胜法相当曲折微妙。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_17]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_67] 以上一段着法，红方目的是逼黑方撑右士，以便后来运帅至六路盯住黑方4路卒时，使得黑方各子没有闲着可走，、此为本局最微妙之处。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_67]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_89]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_89]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_87]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_87]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_79]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_79]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_51]下着黑方有两种走法:[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_51]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_57]红方胜定。[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_57]
[DhtmlXQ_comment6_57]下同主着法。[/DhtmlXQ_comment6_57]
[DhtmlXQ_comment7_37]破士后，红方胜定。[/DhtmlXQ_comment7_37]
[DhtmlXQ_comment8_31]捉双，红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment8_31]
[DhtmlXQ_type]摆谱中残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
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