寻找“孪生局”

老鸽子

“孪  生  局”  简  介

        “孪生局”系将某一排局的全部或部分棋子向左或右，向上或下整体移动一步或数步而成。由任云首创，初载于《象棋报》第106、107期（据本人推算，刊于1987年尾）。这是一种新的排局创作形式，出现已近四十年。

        “孪生局”与同型局都是在旧局的基础上改拟而成，但大不相同。同型局相对原局，图、着皆似，而“孪生局”相对原图虽存在关联，但图、着皆异——按原图搜不出孪生局，且着法完全不同。因此，“孪生局”很难发现，本人留意了好几年，也仅找到了五组十来局。但既然作为一种新的排局体裁，这个数量显然不够，至少应收藏30局（两页）以上，故在这里向诸排局大家请教。现将已找到的棋局列举如下：

老鸽子

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
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[DhtmlXQ_adddate]2019-12-29 15:44:21[/DhtmlXQ_adddate]
[DhtmlXQ_editdate]2020-08-22 20:11:15[/DhtmlXQ_editdate]
[DhtmlXQ_title]《象局集锦》第三集第2局 方诚失险（1-1）[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]22415150313050516261406130315150272061404162505162705150313040523032524020405040443440307051303145413130414030314030[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
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[DhtmlXQ_sortid]15441910[/DhtmlXQ_sortid]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]老鸽子[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_oldowner]老鸽子[/DhtmlXQ_oldowner]
[DhtmlXQ_comment0]永嘉林弈仙拟局。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0][DhtmlXQ_comment29]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment29][DhtmlXQ_comment24]？？？[/DhtmlXQ_comment24][DhtmlXQ_comment21]？？？[/DhtmlXQ_comment21]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.dpxq.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.dpxq.com/hldcg/search/index.asp[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator][/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

老鸽子

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]3599999939999912172621999999523443239999419999304699992848579999[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_pver]130606[/DhtmlXQ_pver]
[DhtmlXQ_adddate]2013-10-05 20:21:00[/DhtmlXQ_adddate]
[DhtmlXQ_editdate]2013-10-05 20:21:00[/DhtmlXQ_editdate]
[DhtmlXQ_title]《象棋报》总第145期 方城失险（1-2）[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]123141402120404152513051202141401710513031524041526041401030403034242331353130403130[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_length]21[/DhtmlXQ_length]
[DhtmlXQ_type][/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_hits]292[/DhtmlXQ_hits]
[DhtmlXQ_sortid]6801680[/DhtmlXQ_sortid]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]老鸽子[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_oldowner]老鸽子[/DhtmlXQ_oldowner]
[DhtmlXQ_comment21]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment21][DhtmlXQ_comment0]1989年8月4日刊。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.dpxq.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.dpxq.com/hldcg/search/index.asp[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator][/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

老鸽子

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
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[DhtmlXQ_binit]9963999959999951319905999999992010709999409999999909994857999999[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_pver]130606[/DhtmlXQ_pver]
[DhtmlXQ_adddate]2021-09-14 15:26:21[/DhtmlXQ_adddate]
[DhtmlXQ_editdate]2021-09-14 15:26:21[/DhtmlXQ_editdate]
[DhtmlXQ_title]《适情雅趣》寻踪觅迹（2-1）[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]203010303130404130404140513240413220413120123141123341403321403063423031425031322113[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
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[DhtmlXQ_event]适情雅趣[/DhtmlXQ_event]
[DhtmlXQ_round]卷一[/DhtmlXQ_round]
[DhtmlXQ_date]0000-00-00[/DhtmlXQ_date]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_hits]182[/DhtmlXQ_hits]
[DhtmlXQ_sortid]17036120[/DhtmlXQ_sortid]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]老鸽子[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_oldowner]老鸽子[/DhtmlXQ_oldowner]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_23]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_23][DhtmlXQ_comment21]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment21][DhtmlXQ_comment0]这是原局。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.dpxq.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.dpxq.com/hldcg/search/index.asp[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator][/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

老鸽子

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
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[DhtmlXQ_adddate]2021-09-14 15:26:21[/DhtmlXQ_adddate]
[DhtmlXQ_editdate]2021-09-14 15:26:21[/DhtmlXQ_editdate]
[DhtmlXQ_title]仇国良《中国象棋趣味局》寻踪觅迹（2-2）[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
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[DhtmlXQ_round][/DhtmlXQ_round]
[DhtmlXQ_date]0000-00-00[/DhtmlXQ_date]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_hits]182[/DhtmlXQ_hits]
[DhtmlXQ_sortid]17036120[/DhtmlXQ_sortid]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]老鸽子[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_oldowner]老鸽子[/DhtmlXQ_oldowner]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]30402040414050514050515061425051423051413022415122435150433150407352404152334142315042320535[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment0]本谱1992年5月出版。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0][DhtmlXQ_comment23]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment23]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.dpxq.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.dpxq.com/hldcg/search/index.asp[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator][/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

老鸽子

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]5554999949999912119999999999993435719999409999993819994758999999[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_pver]130606[/DhtmlXQ_pver]
[DhtmlXQ_adddate]2021-09-14 18:35:47[/DhtmlXQ_adddate]
[DhtmlXQ_editdate]2021-09-14 18:35:47[/DhtmlXQ_editdate]
[DhtmlXQ_title]《适情雅趣》鱼跃于渊（3-1）[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]114140415433414033214030214230404261404112334131555131305150303133123141615371521233413133523141523341313312[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
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[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_length]51[/DhtmlXQ_length]
[DhtmlXQ_class][/DhtmlXQ_class]
[DhtmlXQ_event]适情雅趣[/DhtmlXQ_event]
[DhtmlXQ_round]卷一[/DhtmlXQ_round]
[DhtmlXQ_date]0000-00-00[/DhtmlXQ_date]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_hits]197[/DhtmlXQ_hits]
[DhtmlXQ_sortid]17036530[/DhtmlXQ_sortid]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]老鸽子[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_oldowner]老鸽子[/DhtmlXQ_oldowner]
[DhtmlXQ_comment27]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment27][DhtmlXQ_comment4_9]下同正着。[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_9][DhtmlXQ_comment2_13]红速胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_13][DhtmlXQ_comment3_13]红速胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_13][DhtmlXQ_comment0]弃车，双马胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.dpxq.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.dpxq.com/hldcg/search/index.asp[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator][/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

邢春波

孪生局的释义是这样吗？我看到不同说法

邢春波

http://www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum ... 7&fromuid=44188

老鸽子

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
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[DhtmlXQ_binit]6564999959999922219999999999994445819999509999999929994857689999[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_pver]130606[/DhtmlXQ_pver]
[DhtmlXQ_adddate]2022-03-17 16:28:17[/DhtmlXQ_adddate]
[DhtmlXQ_editdate]2022-03-17 16:28:17[/DhtmlXQ_editdate]
[DhtmlXQ_title]彭树荣《象局钩奇》鱼跃于渊一（3-2）[/DhtmlXQ_title]
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[DhtmlXQ_place][/DhtmlXQ_place]
[DhtmlXQ_round][/DhtmlXQ_round]
[DhtmlXQ_table][/DhtmlXQ_table]
[DhtmlXQ_date]2015-10-05[/DhtmlXQ_date]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_result]
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[DhtmlXQ_owner]老鸽子[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_oldowner]老鸽子[/DhtmlXQ_oldowner]
[DhtmlXQ_comment17]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment17]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_1]504051414050414050406452405052715051656151506141[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_1][DhtmlXQ_comment1_13]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_13]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_4_2]5150433150403152405052715051656151506141[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_4_2][DhtmlXQ_comment2_13]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_13]
[DhtmlXQ_comment0]任云拟局，原载《象棋报》总106或107期？||||仇国良《中国象棋趣味局》、陈罗平等《世界象棋排局大全》亦载。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.dpxq.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.dpxq.com/hldcg/search/index.asp[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator][/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

老鸽子

邢春波 发表于 2024-11-15 18:15
孪生局的释义是这样吗？我看到不同说法

是啊，其定义我摘自彭树荣《象局钩奇》，只是文字上略有精减而已（标题帖简介中的其它内容才是我自己写的）。您所帖的“孪生局”意义不同，应是同型局或衍生局。

老鸽子

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
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[DhtmlXQ_pver]130606[/DhtmlXQ_pver]
[DhtmlXQ_adddate]2008-10-21 16:55:01[/DhtmlXQ_adddate]
[DhtmlXQ_editdate]2019-01-24 12:02:24[/DhtmlXQ_editdate]
[DhtmlXQ_title]彭树荣《象局钩奇》鱼跃于渊二（3-3）[/DhtmlXQ_title]
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[DhtmlXQ_owner]老鸽子[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_oldowner]老鸽子[/DhtmlXQ_oldowner]
[DhtmlXQ_comment7]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment7][DhtmlXQ_comment1_7]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_7][DhtmlXQ_comment0]任云拟局，原载《象棋报》总106或107期？||||仇国良《中国象棋趣味局》、陈罗平等《世界象棋排局大全》亦载。||||将棋子左移一格，成了非常简短的小局，那就仅适合作趣味排局了。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.dpxq.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.dpxq.com/hldcg/search/index.asp[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator][/DhtmlXQ_generator]
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老鸽子

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]6599999959999942416753999999999943999999309999997510994899999999[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
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[DhtmlXQ_adddate]2021-11-02 06:42:14[/DhtmlXQ_adddate]
[DhtmlXQ_editdate]2021-11-02 06:42:14[/DhtmlXQ_editdate]
[DhtmlXQ_title]《适情雅趣》路车乘马（4-1）[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]4131303165613132535232426762[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
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[DhtmlXQ_event]适情雅趣[/DhtmlXQ_event]
[DhtmlXQ_round]卷三[/DhtmlXQ_round]
[DhtmlXQ_date]0000-00-00[/DhtmlXQ_date]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_hits]241[/DhtmlXQ_hits]
[DhtmlXQ_sortid]17124490[/DhtmlXQ_sortid]
[DhtmlXQ_comment0]弃车马，重炮胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0][DhtmlXQ_comment7]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment7]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.dpxq.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.dpxq.com/hldcg/search/index.asp[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator][/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

老鸽子

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
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[DhtmlXQ_adddate]2021-11-02 06:42:14[/DhtmlXQ_adddate]
[DhtmlXQ_editdate]2021-11-02 06:42:14[/DhtmlXQ_editdate]
[DhtmlXQ_title]彭树荣《象局钩奇》路车乘马（4-2）[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_length]7[/DhtmlXQ_length]
[DhtmlXQ_class][/DhtmlXQ_class]
[DhtmlXQ_event]适情雅趣[/DhtmlXQ_event]
[DhtmlXQ_round][/DhtmlXQ_round]
[DhtmlXQ_date]0000-00-00[/DhtmlXQ_date]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_hits]241[/DhtmlXQ_hits]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment17]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment17]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_4_1]313066604340545040465051464011103031676131321012[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_4_1][DhtmlXQ_comment1_15]亦红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_15][DhtmlXQ_comment0]任云拟局，原载《象棋报》总106或107期？||||本局向下移子一格，延长了着法，系有效移动[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.dpxq.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.dpxq.com/hldcg/search/index.asp[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator][/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

老鸽子

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
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[DhtmlXQ_adddate]2017-08-09 00:32:33[/DhtmlXQ_adddate]
[DhtmlXQ_editdate]2017-08-09 00:32:33[/DhtmlXQ_editdate]
[DhtmlXQ_title]《羊城体育》第236期 兵不厌诈（5-1）[/DhtmlXQ_title]
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[DhtmlXQ_event]羊城体育排局研究[/DhtmlXQ_event]
[DhtmlXQ_round][/DhtmlXQ_round]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_hits]282[/DhtmlXQ_hits]
[DhtmlXQ_sortid]12592110[/DhtmlXQ_sortid]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]老鸽子[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_oldowner]老鸽子[/DhtmlXQ_oldowner]
[DhtmlXQ_comment0]姚佑根拟局，这是一则原创孪生局。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0][DhtmlXQ_comment31]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment31][DhtmlXQ_comment2_9]红速胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_9][DhtmlXQ_comment1_27]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_27]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.dpxq.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.dpxq.com/hldcg/search/index.asp[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator][/DhtmlXQ_generator]
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老鸽子

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[DhtmlXQ_title]《羊城体育》第236期 兵不血刃（5-2）[/DhtmlXQ_title]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment0]姚佑根拟局。||||将上局各子向右移动了一格，但上局红帅已在四路，无法右移，于是向左移了一格。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0][DhtmlXQ_comment35]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment35][DhtmlXQ_comment9_9]红速胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment9_9][DhtmlXQ_comment5_23]红速胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_23][DhtmlXQ_comment6_15]红速胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment6_15][DhtmlXQ_comment7_13]红速胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment7_13][DhtmlXQ_comment4_13]同上注[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_13][DhtmlXQ_comment2_21]红速胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_21][DhtmlXQ_comment3_19]红速胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_19][DhtmlXQ_comment1_19]红速胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_19]
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老鸽子

《羊城体育》1995年1月6日创刊，系周刊，据此推算，“兵不厌诈“、”兵不血刃“两局载于1999年年中。

湖艓

邢春波 发表于 2024-11-15 18:16
http://www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=56827&fromuid=44188

也有姊妹局的说法

石川铃华老湿

湖艓 发表于 2024-11-15 21:59
也有姊妹局的说法

要说 姐妹局，大湿一大堆啊~~~

无心恋

我觉得同型局或姊妹局应该有以下特点：
1、与原局棋型非常相似，容易使人混淆，可移动几个子的位置，也可适应添加一两子；
2、与原局着法完全不同或中间某个回合完全不同，正着变劣着，劣着变正着。
例如《识将还军》和《反识将》纯属个人意见

yjr123

我认为：

同型局：顾名思义就是棋型相似
姊妹局：棋型极其相似但着法完全不同
孪生局：棋型子力完全相同但平移错位

聨吟客

yjr123 发表于 2024-11-21 13:40
我认为：

同型局：顾名思义就是棋型相似

怎麼漏了一個  克隆局


克隆局:????????????


哈哈哈哈哈哈哈哈哈哈哈哈