红能求和吗

杨启忠 · 发表于 2014-6-10 16:45:49

zhaodi 发表于 2014-6-10 15:53
作为排局作者，应熟练运用几个工具，
1、连照胜局，用周软验证；
2、非连照胜局，用主流象棋软件，如象棋 ...

嗯，是的，我本人应该多学学，否则就落伍啦。

yuntao云涛 · 发表于 2014-6-10 19:44:21

zhaodi 发表于 2014-6-10 15:53
作为排局作者，应熟练运用几个工具，
1、连照胜局，用周软验证；
2、非连照胜局，用主流象棋软件，如象棋 ...

是啊，譬如残局库都是前人的经验总结出来的，有了这些工具就可以事半功倍了，

yjr123 · 发表于 2014-6-10 20:14:24

zhaodi 发表于 2014-6-10 15:53
作为排局作者，应熟练运用几个工具，
1、连照胜局，用周软验证；
2、非连照胜局，用主流象棋软件，如象棋 ...

黄志琦残排局库只是收集汇总，没有验证功能。

yuntao云涛 · 发表于 2014-6-12 09:44:18

zhaodi 发表于 2014-6-9 18:02
回78楼，第10回合黑应进车将军。

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yuntao云涛 · 发表于 2014-6-12 12:26:59

yjr123 发表于 2014-6-9 15:57

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菜鸟来玩 · 发表于 2014-9-17 21:12:14

yuntao云涛发表于 2014-6-12 12:26

本局红求和唯一的招法就是退车抓后卒，并且车四路线，平车将军跟平炮都是必败的招。谢谢，这个局面残局库需要30万左右的电脑才能跑出来。谢谢

yuntao云涛 · 发表于 2014-9-19 02:31:07

菜鸟来玩发表于 2014-9-17 21:12
本局红求和唯一的招法就是退车抓后卒，并且车四路线，平车将军跟平炮都是必败的招。谢谢，这个局面残局库 ...

此局当真有那么的复杂？比你给我的那些有几百亿个变化的残局还要复杂吗？难道真能难倒我们华工众多高手的人脑？

zhaodi · 发表于 2014-9-19 13:05:55

我认为此局黑胜。退车抓后卒的变化，前几页帖子中有，如有异议，请提出来，大家再讨论。

回复95楼。
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yjr123 · 发表于 2014-9-19 13:48:36

yuntao云涛发表于 2014-9-19 02:31
此局当真有那么的复杂？比你给我的那些有几百亿个变化的残局还要复杂吗？难道真能难倒我们华工众多高手的 ...

依据菜鸟残局库的提示，本局按亚规应该是和棋，就是首着必须退车抓卒，其余都是黑胜。

能够取胜的残局软件可以跑出一条棋路，和棋就比较难了，软件跑出的棋路人可能无法理解（如卒怎么越跑越远离中心了）。

柒匹狼 · 发表于 2014-9-19 13:59:58

变化已经挖的差不多了亚规还要再研究下吗

菜鸟来玩 · 发表于 2014-9-19 15:41:47

真厉害-yir123，我什么时候扯亚规了，无中生有，呵呵

柒匹狼 · 发表于 2014-9-19 15:50:39

即是爱好也是娱乐同是讨论难免有说辞不当的地方彼此多多海涵棋待长进人情在交

菜鸟来玩 · 发表于 2014-9-19 16:17:50

既然不认同软件或者亚规，还请不要参与进来，就让我自娱自乐，高手更应该去值得研究的地方，不是吗。

yjr123 · 发表于 2014-9-19 16:45:28

菜鸟来玩发表于 2014-9-19 16:17
既然不认同软件或者亚规，还请不要参与进来，就让我自娱自乐，高手更应该去值得研究的地方，不是吗。

没有不认同，我也是用软件人机合一来研究排局的，现在的软件或残局库都是用的亚规，因此对软件的着法还需进一步分析，没有牵涉棋规的，残局库结论基本没有问题，但牵涉棋规就要具体分析了，这并不是你不扯亚规就和亚规无关了。

本局你并没有给出着法，因此也无法分析残局库的着法是否牵涉棋规。

菜鸟来玩 · 发表于 2014-9-19 16:56:15

你跟它讲法律，它就跟你讲道德。
它就跟你讲道德。你跟它讲法律，

yjr123 · 发表于 2014-9-19 17:21:57

虽然你的软件或残局库厉害，但你的理解力却让人莫名其妙，似乎是无中生有的挑衅，难道我有什么地方说错了吗？

yuntao云涛 · 发表于 2014-9-19 19:04:07

柒匹狼发表于 2014-9-19 13:59
变化已经挖的差不多了亚规还要再研究下吗

既然你觉得已经挖的差不多了，相信你可以给出此局的主要几个变化，请演化给大家欣赏欣赏

柒匹狼 · 发表于 2014-9-19 19:33:49

这个抱歉此贴成果和我没有一点关系我说的研究差不多了是指回帖研究结果要我研究车四退三我没那棋力要我整理别人的研究成果另发个回复这个更不太好对于此残局我是一点破解能力都没有只能看看别人研究的成果

yuntao云涛 · 发表于 2014-9-20 19:53:17

本帖最后由 yuntao云涛于 2014-9-20 19:59 编辑

zhaodi 发表于 2014-9-19 13:05
我认为此局黑胜。退车抓后卒的变化，前几页帖子中有，如有异议，请提出来，大家再讨论。

回复95楼。

赵老师怎么认为黑胜呢？红车平中黑胜的可能性是很大。关于红退车抓后卒的变化，前几页帖子中也没有定论是黑胜的，如果赵老师认为黑胜，请列举出黑胜的着法，更方便利于大家再讨论

zhaodi · 发表于 2014-9-20 20:28:41

请看22楼及以后的帖子，就22楼帖子的最后局面，我个人拆解，无论先后，都是黑胜。当然，还有一路目前我没有拆透。
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象棋法官 · 发表于 2014-9-20 20:50:40

接下来怎么走？
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zhaodi · 发表于 2014-9-20 21:40:08

回复楼上
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象棋法官 · 发表于 2014-9-20 22:46:21

zhaodi 发表于 2014-9-20 21:40
回复楼上

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zhaodi · 发表于 2014-9-20 22:55:44

象棋法官发表于 2014-9-20 22:46

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[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999959990799534999999999999962999999409999999999993638999999[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_pver]130606[/DhtmlXQ_pver]
[DhtmlXQ_adddate]2014-5-29 12:46:15[/DhtmlXQ_adddate]
[DhtmlXQ_editdate]2014-5-30 12:11:01[/DhtmlXQ_editdate]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_length]521[/DhtmlXQ_length]
[DhtmlXQ_event]云涛[/DhtmlXQ_event]
[DhtmlXQ_date]2014,05,30[/DhtmlXQ_date]
[DhtmlXQ_hits]34[/DhtmlXQ_hits]
[DhtmlXQ_sortid]8096690[/DhtmlXQ_sortid]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]yuntao[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_oldowner]yuntao[/DhtmlXQ_oldowner]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]5356363756573727072540305755273755576232575637275958271749593272[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_12]此局面黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_12]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_9_1]5535304035556232[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_9_1]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D32492%26page%3D4%26extra%3D%23pid236134[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

我110楼的图是直接从前几页的他人帖子复制过来的，他的着法有误。

我个人认为，对付红退车捉后卒，应该按一下着法顺序走。

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999959990799534999999999999962999999409999999999993638999999[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_pver]130606[/DhtmlXQ_pver]
[DhtmlXQ_adddate]2014-5-29 12:46:15[/DhtmlXQ_adddate]
[DhtmlXQ_editdate]2014-5-30 12:11:01[/DhtmlXQ_editdate]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_length]521[/DhtmlXQ_length]
[DhtmlXQ_event]云涛[/DhtmlXQ_event]
[DhtmlXQ_date]2014,05,30[/DhtmlXQ_date]
[DhtmlXQ_hits]34[/DhtmlXQ_hits]
[DhtmlXQ_sortid]8096690[/DhtmlXQ_sortid]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]yuntao[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_oldowner]yuntao[/DhtmlXQ_oldowner]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]53563637565737270725403057556232[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_12]此局面黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_12]
[DhtmlXQ_move_2_9_1]5535304035556232[/DhtmlXQ_move_2_9_1]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_8_2]2737555762325756[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_8_2]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D32492%26page%3D4%23pid236132[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

象棋法官 · 发表于 2014-9-20 23:03:36

第三回合走车：
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999959990799534999999999999962999999409999999999993638999999[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_pver]130606[/DhtmlXQ_pver]
[DhtmlXQ_adddate]2014-5-29 12:46:15[/DhtmlXQ_adddate]
[DhtmlXQ_editdate]2014-5-30 12:11:01[/DhtmlXQ_editdate]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_length]521[/DhtmlXQ_length]
[DhtmlXQ_event]云涛[/DhtmlXQ_event]
[DhtmlXQ_date]2014,05,30[/DhtmlXQ_date]
[DhtmlXQ_hits]34[/DhtmlXQ_hits]
[DhtmlXQ_sortid]8096690[/DhtmlXQ_sortid]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]yuntao[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_oldowner]yuntao[/DhtmlXQ_oldowner]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]535636375657372757554030553530403555623259584030495932725949727858593839553530403539[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D32492%26extra%3Dpage%253D1%26page%3D4[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

zhaodi · 发表于 2014-9-20 23:18:58

象棋法官发表于 2014-9-20 23:03
第三回合走车：

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999959990799534999999999999962999999409999999999993638999999[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_pver]130606[/DhtmlXQ_pver]
[DhtmlXQ_adddate]2014-5-29 12:46:15[/DhtmlXQ_adddate]
[DhtmlXQ_editdate]2014-5-30 12:11:01[/DhtmlXQ_editdate]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_length]521[/DhtmlXQ_length]
[DhtmlXQ_event]云涛[/DhtmlXQ_event]
[DhtmlXQ_date]2014,05,30[/DhtmlXQ_date]
[DhtmlXQ_hits]34[/DhtmlXQ_hits]
[DhtmlXQ_sortid]8096690[/DhtmlXQ_sortid]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]yuntao[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_oldowner]yuntao[/DhtmlXQ_oldowner]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]53563637565737275755623259584030495932725949727955353040354540300725796945446965[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_6_1]4030553530403538[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_6_1]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_9]和棋[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_9][DhtmlXQ_comment1_6]次序不对[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_6][DhtmlXQ_comment2_30]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_30]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_19_2]495969685857384845353040594948493545403045496865[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_19_2][DhtmlXQ_comment2_19]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_19][DhtmlXQ_comment19]离开了要地。[/DhtmlXQ_comment19][DhtmlXQ_comment20]叫杀，红丢相。黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment20]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D32492%26page%3D4%26extra%3D%23pid236134[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

象棋法官 · 发表于 2014-9-20 23:23:58

zhaodi 发表于 2014-9-20 23:18

车不动，改走相七退九。

zhaodi · 发表于 2014-9-20 23:28:24

车7退1将军

象棋法官 · 发表于 2014-9-20 23:30:56

zhaodi 发表于 2014-9-20 23:28
车7退1将军

贴上图：
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999959990799534999999999999962999999409999999999993638999999[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_pver]130606[/DhtmlXQ_pver]
[DhtmlXQ_adddate]2014-5-29 12:46:15[/DhtmlXQ_adddate]
[DhtmlXQ_editdate]2014-5-30 12:11:01[/DhtmlXQ_editdate]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_length]521[/DhtmlXQ_length]
[DhtmlXQ_event]云涛[/DhtmlXQ_event]
[DhtmlXQ_date]2014,05,30[/DhtmlXQ_date]
[DhtmlXQ_hits]34[/DhtmlXQ_hits]
[DhtmlXQ_sortid]8096690[/DhtmlXQ_sortid]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]yuntao[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_oldowner]yuntao[/DhtmlXQ_oldowner]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]535636375657372757556232595840304959327259497279553530403545403007257969250769685859[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_6_1]4030553530403538[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_6_1]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_9]和棋[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_9]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_6]次序不对[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_6]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_30]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_30]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_19_3]45446965[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_19_3][DhtmlXQ_move_0_19_2]495969685857384845353040594948493545403045496865[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_19_2]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_19]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_19]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_19]离开了要地。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_19]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_20]叫杀，红丢相。黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_20]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D32492%26page%3D4[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

zhaodi · 发表于 2014-9-20 23:33:57

象棋法官发表于 2014-9-20 23:30
贴上图：

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999959990799534999999999999962999999409999999999993638999999[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_pver]130606[/DhtmlXQ_pver]
[DhtmlXQ_adddate]2014-5-29 12:46:15[/DhtmlXQ_adddate]
[DhtmlXQ_editdate]2014-5-30 12:11:01[/DhtmlXQ_editdate]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_length]521[/DhtmlXQ_length]
[DhtmlXQ_event]云涛[/DhtmlXQ_event]
[DhtmlXQ_date]2014,05,30[/DhtmlXQ_date]
[DhtmlXQ_hits]34[/DhtmlXQ_hits]
[DhtmlXQ_sortid]8096690[/DhtmlXQ_sortid]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]yuntao[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_oldowner]yuntao[/DhtmlXQ_oldowner]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]53563637565737275755623259584030495932725949727955353040354540300725796925076968585727370725686957583848[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_6_1]4030553530403538[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_6_1]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_9]和棋[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_9]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_6]次序不对[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_6]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_30]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_30]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_19_3]45446965[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_19_3]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_19_2]495969685857384845353040594948493545403045496865[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_19_2]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_19]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_19]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_19]离开了要地。[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_19]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_20]叫杀，红丢相。黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_20]
[DhtmlXQ_comment26]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_28]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_28]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_21_4]58592728454738394737304037396866[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_21_4]
[DhtmlXQ_move_4_23_5]455538394946394959492838[/DhtmlXQ_move_4_23_5][DhtmlXQ_comment5_28]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_28]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D32492%26page%3D4%26extra%3D%23pid236143[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

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